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#21: Browns select Phil Taylor, DT, Baylor

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http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/sh...wn-40-38-Phil-Taylor-DT-Baylor?urn=nfl-319265

Pros: Incredibly agile for his size (6-foot-4, 337 pounds), Taylor's faster in a five-yard radius than anyone this big should be. Very quick off the snap, and it doesn't take him long to get his weight redistributed if he needs to get off a pass rush and back off to cover or help stop a running play. Locks on well and can fool blockers with a quick spin move. Will split double-teams with speed more than power. Taylor isn't limited to zero- and one-tech looks, he'll occasionally shade outside the guard and become a real problem as a huge three-tech - he has the skill set to do so.

Taylor has surprising sideline-to-sideline speed, and he doesn't get gassed after a 20-yard run. He is excellent at sliding off single blocks and accelerating to the ballcarrier. Flashes decent pass-rush for his size and role; as a three-tech tackle, he can get pretty low and get around a blocker to harass the quarterback
. Would seem to transfer well to a role right over center if need be because he engages double-teams and doesn't lose them - this would be a crucial attribute for a player his size. Good with his hands; has the upper-body strength to push a guard out of the way with a quick slap. Really turned it on at the Senior Bowl and should impress in the agility drills at the scouting combine.

Cons: For a one-gap tackle, Taylor is disturbingly easy to push sideways and out of the play - if he doesn't get the first burst, he doesn't always win the power battle. Hasn't run a lot of loops and twists and doesn't seem particularly effective when doing so; the Baylor defense seemed more straight-ahead with its defensive linemen, so this may be a matter of technique over time. Transferred to Baylor after two years at Penn State; was suspended and then kicked off the Nittany Lions' roster after his alleged role in a fight at a student union function and sat out the 2008 season as a result. Occasional lapses in play; he'll need to find more consistency at the next level.

Conclusion: It's difficult for me to grade Taylor as a nose-over-center tackle in the mold of Casey Hampton(notes), Kris Jenkins(notes) or Vince Wilfork(notes); those players are less likely to get pushed aside by guards. And for all his size, Taylor isn't a squatty guy - he's a bit more lean and muscular in a way that makes me wonder if a 3-4 team might not want him to put on 10 pounds or so.

Right now, he's an interesting hybrid player who would most easily succeed in a system where he's all over the line - he could have a Justin Smith(notes)-style impact if he's on a 3-4/4-3 line where he's all over the line. Looking at the height/weight and immediately assuming that he's an instant nose tackle who just has surprising speed would be a rather large mistake. If he answers any character concerns and finds the right spot, Taylor could be a dominant defender for years to come.

NFL Comparison: Shaun Rogers(notes), NT, Cleveland Browns (circa 2008)
 
This is why I was upset we dumped Shaun Rogers. I knew losing him would lead to a gaping hole at DT that would have to be filled, which would in turn mean we couldn't fill a hole at another position.

I don't get it, but whatever. His positives are that he is huge and can stop run. His negatives are that he is lazy, can't play a full a game, no pass rush, and is supposedly stupid. I won't judge him until I see him play for the Browns, but from what I have read, the negatives far outweigh the positives. The guys on ESPN also seemed to be like "WTF are the Browns doing?" Also seems odd we are going with two HUGE DT's.

Edit- forgot to mention foot problems and on his Twitter his bio says "on the hunt to get this money ya digg"

LMAO, can somebody explain to me why they like this pick, because I sure as hell know you didn't watch the guy play a bunch of games. The list of negatives is really stacking up compared to the positives of he is huge and can stop the run.
I don't know, if Julio Jones is worth 5 picks to the Falcons, he is worth 1 pick to me.

A 30-some year old Shaun Rogers was a time bomb waiting to blow up in our face. You basically got the younger version of him. Tough to complain.
 
Obviously Bowers failed his physical miserably.

Funny, he sort of reminds me of Rogers. The combo of him and Rubin reminds me of the Vikings defensive interior of the Williams'. I guess it's not the flashy pick, but it was definitely needed. Best player on the board? Not convinced, but I was scratching my head on the TJ Ward pick too- thinking it was too early.
 
.
# Strengths: Massive frame and carries weight well
# Great strength and power
# Violent, quick hands and uses them well
# Can push pocket with bull rush
# Run-stuffing anchor
# Space eater who occupies blockers
# Agile for his size with good balance
# Mean streak
# Scheme versatile nose tackle



Weaknesses:
# Has dropped considerable weight, but still a concern
# Just one year of top production
# Tendency to play too high, especially when tired
# Not much of a pass rusher
# Inconsistent
# Character - dismissed from Penn State's team
# Durability concerns (knee 2007 - turf toe 2009)


Summary: Phil Taylor started his career at Penn State on the same defensive line as Jared Odrick, whom the Miami Dolphins took in the first round of the 2010 NFL Draft. Unfortunately Taylor was suspended and later kicked off the team for his alleged involvement (charges were dropped) in a fight at a 2007 fraternity function. This is something he has to answer for although a lot of time has passed.


Taylor finally got back to his playing potential in 2010, and by all accounts, he made the most of his fresh start. On the field he is the consensus top prospect for teams looking to fill the nose tackle position in their 3-4. At the next level, he needs to keep his weight under control, improve his stamina and get after the passer a little more to be an elite player. Still, right now he can step in and make an impact in a rotation as a run stopper whom offenses need to avoid.


Player Comparison: Cam Thomas. Across the board these players had nearly identical measurable for size (height/weight, arm/hand) and performance (bench press/40) at their respective NFL Combines. Thomas was also athletic and looked like he would be taken in the second or third round before unexpectedly slipping to San Diego in the fifth, revealing just how uncertain the draft process can be. Both players are space eaters who tend to play high and are unlikely to contribute much rushing the passer.

It might not be glamorous to compare Taylor to a player who just dropped considerably in last year's draft and did not do much as a rookie, but I see a lot of similarities.
 
A few of my friends were bitching about this pick saying that we basically just got a younger Shaun Rogers. I am trying to figure out how this is a bad thing, considering Rogers made a few Pro-Bowls and was just an all-around monster...

Overall, I like the pick. I'm not big on trading up for him, but I trust that Heckert and Holmgren knew that they were getting him at the right time.
 
A few of my friends were bitching about this pick saying that we basically just got a younger Shaun Rogers. I am trying to figure out how this is a bad thing, considering Rogers made a few Pro-Bowls and was just an all-around monster...

Overall, I like the pick. I'm not big on trading up for him, but I trust that Heckert and Holmgren knew that they were getting him at the right time.

Don't see that comparison at all. Rogers was/is a pass rushing DT. This guy is a run stuffer that had a whopping 2 career sacks. Besides being fat and lazy, that is a stupid comparison.
 
Transcript of Heckert and Shurmer after Day 1:
------------------------------------------------------
The transcript of GM Tom Heckert and Coach Pat Shurmur's joint press conference after the team's first round pick in the 2011 NFL Draft.
Browns Head Coach Pat Shurmur and General Manager Tom Heckert
press conference 4-28-11

Tom Heckert
(On why the team decided to trade down from the number six pick)- “Like we talked about before, if we thought something was really, really intriguing to us where we could add more players, then we were going to do it. We’re not saying that we are one player away, even though there were some good players there, we just thought that what we got for the pick was just too much to turn down. We felt really good about it.”

Tom Heckert
(On why the team selected Phil Taylor over Da’Quan Bowers)- “We really like Phil Taylor and we think he is a really good football player. He obviously is a huge man and we think with him and (Ahtyba) Rubin inside we are going to be tough inside. We just thought Phil Taylor was a really good player and that’s why we picked him.”

Tom Heckert
(On why the team traded up to draft Taylor)- “There were a lot of different things that were going into it. It was how our board felt and how high we had Phil on our board. We just thought he was such a good player where we had him that it was too risky for us to not get him.”

Pat Shurmur
(On if Taylor could start as a rookie)- “There is absolutely no question that he can. He’s got size, he can play the run and he has pass-rush ability inside. When you are putting together a 4-3 line, to have two big bodies like we now have, I think is going to be good for us.”

Tom Heckert
(On how confident he is that Taylor will not have character problems)- “100%. Obviously Jordan Norwood’s dad coached him and I think Phil brought Jordan’s dad to the draft with him. We spent a lot of time with him and he was with him at Penn State and brought him to Baylor so we did a lot of things. We brought Phil in here and spent a lot of time with him. Yes, we think Phil is a great young man and he admits that he made a mistake. I think it was a bunch of guys involved in the same thing, we are not condoning that, but we have no reservations what so ever.”

Pat Shurmur
(On where Taylor will play on the defensive line)- “There is a chance that he can play right or left. He can play on the nose as well as on the guard.”

Pat Shurmur
(On if Taylor fits the mold as a pass-rushing defensive tackle)- “Absolutely, he is a giant man and we feel as though, as I mentioned, play the run, but he can get that push in the middle that is really disruptive for quarterbacks.”

Tom Heckert
(On the threat of another team taking Taylor)- “He was so high on our board that we just figured that somebody else might do the same thing. We had a chance to get him so we did, but we thought there was a chance that he might go whether that is true or not, I guess we will never know.”

Tom Heckert
(On what the decision to trade down from the sixth pick ultimately was)- “I have been talking to Thomas (Dimitroff) for probably two weeks about this deal, things have changed and finally we worked out a deal. About two days ago, I thought it was probably going to happen and last night and this morning we talked, and we have been talking about this a lot, so I thought there was a pretty good chance that it was going to happen.”

Tom Heckert
(On the possibility that there might not be a draft next year)- “We obviously talked about it, but there has been a draft forever so it would be quite a bit of difference if there wasn’t. Obviously we had to talk about it, but I think there is going to be a draft.”

Pat Shurmur
(On concern over a weight issue with Taylor)- “I am not concerned about that. We did our background work on him and we feel like he will be able to manage and control his weight and play at the weight that he is going to be most productive. We feel very confident that it is not going to be an issue.”

Tom Heckert
“It was actually kind of funny. We brought him and Da’Quan Bowers in at the same time and went out to dinner. I was talking to Da’Quan and I asked, ‘How much did you eat?’ and he said ‘Oh, I ate more than Phil.’ Phil was eating salmon. Phil is really conscientious about it, he really is and he feels good at this weight and I think he realizes that he has got to do it and he has been great. He is actually one of the guys, where some guys drop weight at the all-star games or the combine, he keeps losing weight. When he was here I think he was 335 or something so he has been going the right direction. We don’t want him too light, he’s good right now, so when you see him tomorrow we will have to tell him that.”

Pat Shurmur
“If you have not seen him he is a big guy and I think that is a good thing.”

Tom Heckert
(On the reason for trading away the sixth pick)- “It was probably more so the multiple picks because there were guys there that we would have felt very comfortable with. I wasn’t lying. I thought if we stayed we were going to get a good player and it came true. There was going to be a good player there so it was more the amount of picks that we got.”

Pat Shurmur
(On if there are a number of holes that still need to be filled with extra picks)- “I don’t know if we want to call them ‘holes.’ I think we have an opportunity in this draft to get more good players and I think that is the approach we are looking at. We are one more player better as of picking Phil, so I think that is the approach as we go into this. If you don’t sense excitement in my voice it’s there. I feel really good about this pick.”

Tom Heckert
(On rumors about Taylor’s feet having problems and if he checked out okay)- “There was absolutely nothing with it. I would have to check on this and I’ll tell you tomorrow, but something showed up like a false-negative on one of the things, so they did a CAT scan, but he’s fine. There are no problems at all, no issues what so ever.

Pat Shurmur
(On if it was tough to not take an offensive player with the first pick)- “I have a little broader view as the head coach. Obviously, we spent a lot of time looking at the defensive players as well.”

Tom Heckert
(On what set Taylor apart)- “I think just his size is something. It was kind of intriguing where he and Danny Watkins, who I think Philadelphia took him, in the Senior Bowl, they got to play against each other. They moved Watkins inside to guard, so here are two really good football players playing against each other and he did a nice job. It’s just the whole package. He’s a big man, like Pat said, he can push the pocket as a pass rusher. If your guards or center are little undersized, he’s going to run right over top of you and that’s intriguing for us.”

Pat Shurmur
(On if Taylor has versatility)- “I think he does, you know we’ll see when we get him in there together, but we feel as though he can possibly play that way.”

Tom Heckert
(On Taylor liking the Browns coaches and their input on him)- “Oh they liked him, there is no question about it, they were overjoyed when we took him. We talked about this when we brought the guys in here, obviously it’s more important for us to get to know the players and everything, but the way we kind of run it, there’s some things that especially with their position coaches that are kind of hard and thy are going over our defense and showing them tape, but there’s also the time when you need to just sit around and talk with the kids. We got a lot of feedback from the players that we brought in here that they wanted to be a part of the Browns. They really did and that’s an intriguing thing for us. If a guy wants to play here and you really like him, it can’t be a better fit.”

Tom Heckert
(On Taylor rotating in and out because of size)- “I’ll tell you what, he didn’t rotate at all at Baylor. If you watch him, he’s playing 80 plays, as a 340 pound defensive lineman he never came out. I think it was the Oklahoma game and they are getting shellacked and he’s playing hard, he’s tired there’s no questions he’s tired but he’s playing every snap and he’s running to the ball and this kid’s effort is not a problem whatsoever.”

Pat Shurmur
“College football has changed a little bit. Teams try and run as many plays as they can at you and that’s a little difficult for a defensive lineman. Trust me, we’d all get tired playing a game where you’re going to play 90 snaps and so I think he’s been trained for this level.”

Tom Heckert
(On Bowers)- “We like Da’Quan and the injury stuff for us is not a concern and he was still on the board. He’s a good football player.”

Tom Heckert
(On drop off point after the fifth pick)- “No, we were talking about this trade and really it was getting to be and I don’t want to get into exactly who but there was probably one guy that we might have at least talked about not doing the trade but honestly we thought it was going to fall almost like it did. We really did. Like I said, last night and this morning Thomas and I both talked and he thought his guy was going to be there, I thought our guys weren’t going to be there, so we knew it was going to happen, unless something crazy happened up top.”

Pat Shurmur
(On stopping the run)- “I wouldn’t say specifically stopping the run, I think it’s important we construct a defense with players that fit the characteristics that we’re looking for. I think we’re pretty much moving forward, there was a lot of good things that happened here last year, but as we’re building it as we go forward, we felt like Phil would be a great fit.”

Tom Heckert
(On Taylor’s weaknesses)- “It’s hard for me to answer, obviously we took him, where we took him so obviously we don’t think he has a lot of weaknesses. I don’t know. I might be the wrong guy to answer that, we like him.”

Pat Shurmur
(On starting off-season workouts)- “We conversations based on what we received from the league today all the coaches actually called the players and we will start the off- season program on Monday. If the players wanted to come in and work out tomorrow unless something has changed in the last few minutes that I don’t know about but we’ll start the off-season program on Monday.”

Pat Shurmur
(On a rookie minicamp)- “It will be soon to come. Actually it won’t be a rookie minicamp. The way we’re going to structure it, it’s the extra minicamp that a new head coach gets. I’m going to bring the whole crowd in.”

Pat Shurmur
(On if minicamp will be next weekend)- “Not next weekend, but soon.”

Pat Shurmur
(On if he will meet with players tomorrow and give them playbooks)- “As of 8 a.m. tomorrow, the one’s that show up, we will be able to provide them with coaching materials.”

Pat Shurmur
(On if the courts could shut the doors again)- “I don’t know. I don’t know what to think. It’s kind of a head up, knees bent type scenario here. I’d like to think we’re going to move forward and I tell you what, we’re going to deal with things as they come. Right now I’m just excited about where we’re headed with this draft and then we’ll wake up in the morning and we’ll see what players are here. The ones that are here, we’ll be able to work with as of 8 a.m. Then, if we don’t hear anything different, then we’ll start the offseason program Monday.”

Tom Heckert
(On direction for their second round pick and if it will be offense-defense)- “No, we’re really not going to go offense-defense. We got a can’t miss deal, whoever the best player up there, we’ll try to take. But really were not thinking offense or defense.

Tom Heckert
(On if his past relationships influencing trades)- “I tell you what it was funny, I was talking to obviously Tom about that and then I talked to Scott Pioli today who’s also good friends with me and Thomas. It helps, you know no one is trying to screw anybody else and its’ just it is what it is. If you don’t agree with it, you can talk about it and it just makes it a lot easier, it really does.”

Tom Heckert
(On where Taylor was on the Browns’ draft board and if he was the top player when they picked him)- “When we took? Yes. Overall, I don’t know. He was higher than obviously when we took him.”

Tom Heckert
(On who was number one the Browns’ draft board)- “I can’t tell you that.”
 
I heard two reasons for the Trade up Phil Taylor and both make sense In odd ways...

1. The steelers were planning a trade Up themselfs before the 27th To take Taylor and KC. was the only team willing to take a trade back with in the 20-27 range

2. The Ravens were Playing games to see where teams were and speculation got out that they were going to Draft Taylor when they never even had interest and scared the browns Into the trade up.

Ok well the steelers Option seems more logical as they went with Hayward as a back up plan... The Ravens have bluffed before and screwed teams out of pics for the hell of It. So I am not sure... New York was a wild card In taking him also.

As for this Pick... I was pissed at first for one reason. The trade with ATL great! I got It... I wanted A WR and we had a good one In our hands there but as some say Is ATL falls flat and Colt does not work and we fail also. We pretty much have the power to grab Luck Or get two high or one high and one lower first round pics where the Browns can go offense and get some playmakers. Now to Why they messed up that trade and ruined It for this year. That guy would have been there and IF not We could have plucked Heyward at 27 and a few big DT's were there In the second. and kept a third In witch we could have gotten a OL there. If you look at the Irony of this trade as... We could have had Jones... aka Edwards but we got Taylor aka Warren. I am not say that Is the case as we have not seem either of them play NFL ball yet. However that seems to be the outlook of alot of Browns fans... So we basically after all that gave gave up Our first this year for... well put It this way. 1stTY for 1stNY and 2ndTY. and filler picks also TY (this year) and NY of course (NY).

That being said I was pissed at first but now that I think about It.... maybe J. Jones did not wanna be In Cleveland because that Is the only reason I do not see them taking him.... oh and not sure hands either. Hmmm ok I get that. So we took a risk On a potential need player who If he pans out we stole and rapped the falcons yet we Lost major ground If Heyward pans out for the steelers as we we could have stood pat and took him If Taylor was gone. So In all this we gained On the first day Building picks for this year to stock up on another 2nd I like It BUT.somewhere we lost a 3rd or possibly two late pics If we trade up. So my final Opinion after my melting stage wore off. Not bad as I now see they are setting up for win or fail this year and If fail we might have some Luck next year In the draft. While I do not agree with the the player or the second trade... I can see the logic written In the Invisable Ink. This year Is a Judgment year and If we pick up a Quality fast WR In the second I will Be ok with day one. To me this seems like alot of teams Drafted for the chance of Luck next year... Min did for sure with the hit or Miss QB they took In the first. Hey Browns fans who are still upset... We could be Minny right now. Look at the bright side!
 
I was a bit thrown off when I first heard about the giving up that #3 just to trade up a few spots to take Taylor because it seemed like we traded our #6 pick for a #21 and a 4th rounder as the 3rd rounder we gave up isn't that much better than the 2nd we got ... but then they finally mentioned the fact we got 2 picks in next years draft as well - so, yeah, we still come out ahead.
 
Phil Taylor, Defensive Tackle, ESPN Insider Profile

6'3¼" 334 lbs

34.0"Arm Length
10.6" Hand Size

Scouting Combine Results

40-Yard Dash 5.09
3-Cone Drill 7.75
20-Yard Shuttle 4.77
Bench Press 31.0
Vertical Jump 29.5
Broad Jump 100.0

1 = Exceptional 2 = Above average 3 = Average 4 = Below average 5 = Marginal

Production, 3
2006: Played 8 games as reserve DT at Penn State.2007: (4/4) At Penn State; 20 tackles, 6.5 TFL, 1 sack.2008: Transfers to Baylor, sits out season under NCAA transfer rules.2009: (12/12) 25 tackles, 2.5 TFL, .5 sack.2010: (13/13) 62 tackles, 7 TFL, 2 sacks, FF.
Height-Weight-Speed, 2
Possesses a massive frame and thick lower half. Top-end speed is good considering size. Has long arms (34 inches) and huge hands (10 3/4 inches).
Durability, 4
Was limited for the first 9 games of the 2007 season at Penn State due to MCL sprain in left knee suffered during preseason camp. In 2009 suffered turf toe against Oklahoma and sat out Iowa State game as a result. Underwent arthroscopic knee surgery in June 2010 to address an issue with loose cartilage but he started all 13 games that season.
Intangibles, 4
Involved in an on-campus fight in October, 2008 while attending Penn State. Was suspended for one game and was charged with aggravated assault, simple assault, harassment and disorderly conduct. Charges were ultimately dismissed but Taylor was suspended from the team in February 2008 and transferreding to Baylor that year. Biggest concern here is with his work ethic. Will he work hard enough off-the-field (practice, conditioning, diet) to reach full potential?
Versus the Run, 1
A massive, wide-body NT with long arms and huge hands. Is inconsistent with leverage but when he fires out of stance low and establishes solid positioning he's a nightmare for OL to deal with in run game. He has tree trunks for legs and can anchor in versus the double team. When he gets off of blocks and finds the ball in time, he moves very well for his size and he's a heavy hitter. However, he gets lazy and often plays too high, which leads to him losing his leverage at the point of attack. His helmet level when two-gapping is too erratic. Needs to keep his head/eyes up instead of dipping his head. He has quick hands and long arms, but does not yet know how to use them to his full advantage. Also has questionable run game awareness. Is inconsistent finding the football and needs to improve in that area.
Pass Rush Skills, 4
Flashes a powerful initial bull rush when staying low and firing off the ball. Moves well for his size and will flash as a pass rusher. Uses hands well and displays an effective quick swim move. Closing burst is good for size. Shows surprisingly good awareness on screens and draws but not often able to get back in the play. However, his snap anticipation is terrible. He's frequently the last Baylor DL off the ball. Fires out too high at times and allow blockers into his body.
Quickness (hands/feet), 3
Displays a powerful initial punch. Quick hands and can latch on and disengage from blockers. However, won't win many battles with first-step quickness and lateral movement is just average. Nimble on feet for size. Plays with balance and protects feet well against cut blocks.
Toughness/Motor, 3
When fresh plays with an edge and fights to work through blocks. Effort is better than the perception. He takes some plays off but not as many as some other top DT prospects in this class who weigh far less than him. Nonetheless, stamina will always be a concern. He carries a lot of weight and needs to work hard to keep in playing shape.
 
Have to say I love the pick. Not for the player that Taylor could be as much as what it represents. H&H are building this team around the defense. Between last year and this year they've spent their top picks on a D tackle, corner and safety. That's exactly how you should rebuild a franchise.

There are two D tackles in the AFC North that absolutely kill us: Casey Hampton and Haloti Ngata. It's even worse that the Browns actually swapped picks with the Ravens so they could take Ngata. That still pisses me off. H&H clearly think Taylor can be our answer to Hampton and Ngata. I sure as hell hope so. There's nothing better for a team in the AFC North than having a fat ass monster who consistently stops the run and gets your D into third and long.
 
The pick of Phil Taylor to the Browns was a big surprise for Browns fans but the fact he went in the later half of the 1st round is not. I looked back at ESPN's mock drafts and Taylor was a late 1st round pick. Most of the time he was going at the end of the round so the Browns moved up a bit farther than the Mocks said they had to but clearly he has 1st round talent and he was in play with some of the teams in the 20s.

Kiper's Mock
1.0: Not in 1st Round
2.0: Not in 1st Round
3.0: Not in 1st Round
4.0: #24 Saints
5.0: #30 Jets

McShay's Mock
1.0: Not in 1st Round
2.0: #30 Jets
3.0: #30 Jets
4.0: #30 Jets
5.0: #30 Jets
6.0: #30 Jets
7.0: #24 Saints

McShay & 2 NFL Scout's Mock
#29 Bears
 
Anyone find this quote from his phone interview funny:

(On where he is right now) — “I’m backstage at the draft, still at the draft. I’m in New York.”

I believe the reporter was looking for an answer along the lines of where he is right now in his shape, etc. Of course he is at the draft....:chuckles:
 
This guy was on the field for 80 snaps a game, that's incredible! About double the snaps of a nick fairley. It makes me wonder if these 'nfl draft analysts' actually bothered to see how much he played in a game aand just assumed he was lazy because he was playing tired. Obviously i'm just speculating here but...
 
gregcosell Greg Cosell
Liked Taylor on film. Played w/athleticism of a smaller man. NT in 3-4 or "1 technique" in 4-3. Chance to develop into inside pass rusher.
 

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