Cedi Osman Goodbye & Good Luck

[macbdog]

It's just a shame the Cavs traded Anthony Bennett. We could've had years of AB - Cedi hookups.

Next time won't you play with me?

I really should be applauding this awful pun, but it took me too many readings for it to dawn on me, and the best awful puns generally elicit my immediate joy.

 

[Lee]

I hope a lockout/strike in 2017-2018 doesn't induce the Outomatic Ottoman to stay over for a couple of additional years.....

Hopefully with the additional cash the two says can get together and void the lockout.

 

[westsidebob]

I really should be applauding this awful pun, but it took me too many readings for it to dawn on me, and the best awful puns generally elicit my immediate joy.

I was really hoping I wouldn't have to spell it out for you, it was pretty much letter perfect.

To get back to the topic at hand, here's hoping Mr. Osman is the consonant professional.


.....I'll show myself out.

 

[Dshuks]

22 points 4 rebounds and 6 assists for Cedi against Iceland today. I really hope we don't trade this guy for a past their prime veteran.

 

[PedroFlu]

Maybe he's the needed asset to join the 10M exception Cleveland will probably need to use to sign a replacement for TT if he bolts after this season..

But it would be a pitty, I like what I'm reading.

 

[Danny Arison]

Cedi "shot clock cheed" Osman

I like him alot

 

[I'mWithDan]

He's an interesting young prospect but for anyone who can make a significant contribution in the next 2-3 years, I'd personally drive him to the airport.

I think people need to really temper their expectations with Cedi. He's a talented player but one that still needs a lot of seasoning....both in EuroLeague and then successfully transitioning to the NBA. Still a lot of unknowns with him.

I wouldn't trade him as filler but I'd move him in just about any other deal for a contributing piece. The Cavs window isn't 4-5 years from now, when Cedi might be good, (or ready) it is 2-3 years. We need to maximize these last few seasons of LeBron's prime and figure everything else out as we go. Planning for the future is over with IMO. Any move that gives us even a 1-2% better chance to win a title should be considered.....even if that means moving Osman.

 

[spydy13]

I wouldn't trade him as filler but I'd move him in just about any other deal for a contributing piece. The Cavs window isn't 4-5 years from now, when Cedi might be good, (or ready) it is 2-3 years. We need to maximize these last few seasons of LeBron's prime and figure everything else out as we go. Planning for the future is over with IMO. Any move that gives us even a 1-2% better chance to win a title should be considered.....even if that means moving Osman.

IMO this is incredibly shortsighted and I hope it's not the thinking of the FO. We can still win with Kyrie and Love leading the charge and an aging LeBron behind them. I agree that the next 2-3 years are our best shot at winning a title but it's not like back in the day when LeBron was our only good player. We can't let desperation to win a title force us into trading important future pieces that can keep this thing going.

 

[westsidebob]

Why can't the Cavs window be 4-5 years from now? They'll still have KI and Love in their primes.

Despite what ESPN would have you believe, it's possible to play to win today while still planting seeds for the future.

Honestly, I don't understand why Griffin would even screw around with guys like Christmas (who they just kicked the can down the road by swapping for another #2). Why not just load up on second round picks and draft every young Euro that looks like he might be able to play?

Actually, for that matter, I'm surprised some forward thinking owner hasn't bought his own team over there yet? Sign kids at 14 to a training team, teach them your system from day 1. Same thing major league teams do with academies in the Dominican and Venezuela.

 

[spydy13]

Actually, for that matter, I'm surprised some forward thinking owner hasn't bought his own team over there yet? Sign kids at 14 to a training team, teach them your system from day 1. Same thing major league teams do with academies in the Dominican and Venezuela.

That would be quite an investment though. You have most forward thinking owners invest in d-league teams here though, which operate with much lower costs due to the salary cap structure.

I think eventually they will need to create some sort of designated player system like in the MLS that allows NBA teams to pay a certain amount of players above that cap though (maybe half way between an NBA minimum salary and the top of the dleague cap (around $25K iirc)). Then teams can actually attract US or foreign talent that they want to take a chance developing but don't have room for on their NBA rosters at the moment.

 

[catfish]

Why can't the Cavs window be 4-5 years from now? They'll still have KI and Love in their primes.

Despite what ESPN would have you believe, it's possible to play to win today while still planting seeds for the future.

Honestly, I don't understand why Griffin would even screw around with guys like Christmas (who they just kicked the can down the road by swapping for another #2). Why not just load up on second round picks and draft every young Euro that looks like he might be able to play?

Actually, for that matter, I'm surprised some forward thinking owner hasn't bought his own team over there yet? Sign kids at 14 to a training team, teach them your system from day 1. Same thing major league teams do with academies in the Dominican and Venezuela.

Idea doesnt make sense in basketball. There is a universal draft and an age limit. No reason some owner would want to get some kid ready so some other owner would reap the benefit. Baseball has wanted a univeral draft but they havent got there yet. What a good owner should do is higher analytics guys at market rate. It is inane to me that with all the money in the sport they go cheap on the brainiacs.

 

[I'mWithDan]

IMO this is incredibly shortsighted and I hope it's not the thinking of the FO. We can still win with Kyrie and Love leading the charge and an aging LeBron behind them. I agree that the next 2-3 years are our best shot at winning a title but it's not like back in the day when LeBron was our only good player. We can't let desperation to win a title force us into trading important future pieces that can keep this thing going.

Does Cedi have the potential to be a top 10 SF/SG? If the answer is no, I would consider moving him. I don't care if it is shortsighted by many peoples' standards. The Cavs' sole focus should be on the next 2-3 years.

Title windows can close really quick. While the eastern conference flat out sucks, teams like Golden State are even younger than the Cavs. So each year that passes (see LeBron dipping even 5-10%), it is going to become harder and harder to win a title.

There's certainly a next level KI can reach and you would hope Love improves but as LeBron ages, nothing gets easier for the team. I think he's the type of player that will still be valuable in his mid 30's but given his mileage, he could also be the type of guy who just falls off a cliff. It's impossible to say.

I think it's also harder to plan further down the road and try to live in a world where KI and Love carry an aging LeBron given the missed games quota between them. Once LeBron really starts on the downward arc of his career, our margin for error (when discussing titles) gets incredibly slim. That is why, for me personally, I would just roll the dice and make any move I can.

I'm not saying that is black and white, I just think franchises like the Spurs require a ton of good fortune. There's just so many moving parts that using them as a measuring stick is unrealistic IMO. Ditto for someone like the Patriots in the NFL. You can't strive for that because most teams will just get lost in the pursuit. When your window opens, you have to be willing to get through it, at all costs, before it closes. The teams that try to do both (play the short and long game) are the ones that can just get caught in the whitewash and end up wondering what the fuck happened. I'd rather unload my gun in LeBron's prime than save a few bullets for a rainy day.

 

[Cavatt]

If we aren't contending with an old LBJ and Love and Kyrie in their prime. Then we already may have bet on the wrong horse.

 

[spydy13]

Does Cedi have the potential to be a top 10 SF/SG? If the answer is no, I would consider moving him.

I don't know why that's your standard though because it's highly doubtful we could get anything close to that in a trade for the limited pieces we have (Osman's rights, late first round picks, TPEs). If he could develop into a solid rotation player, which is all I'm expecting from him at the moment, then that's probably superior over anything we can trade for (I for one am very doubtful that we can pull off anything like we did to get JR, Shump, and Moz because those took very unique circumstances and a lot of relatively good assets.).

I mean if you can get a stud guy by trading Osman then we should do that deal, but I'm highly speculative of that happening. Potentially having a young guy slide into our rotation in a couple years sounds like a nice thing, especially since we're already somewhat light at the 2/3 spot on the bench.

I'm not saying that is black and white, I just think franchises like the Spurs require a ton of good fortune. There's just so many moving parts that using them as a measuring stick is unrealistic IMO. Ditto for someone like the Patriots in the NFL. You can't strive for that because most teams will just get lost in the pursuit.

Those teams aren't just lucky though. They have built quality organizations that can rebuild on the fly. Both also had their years in the wilderness where they didn't win titles as well, but they eventually put everything together again to win, and they did it by not just trying to go all in for one or two years. Which isn't to say that what they do isn't incredibly hard, but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't strive to emulate their model.

 

[westsidebob]

Idea doesnt make sense in basketball. There is a universal draft and an age limit. No reason some owner would want to get some kid ready so some other owner would reap the benefit. Baseball has wanted a univeral draft but they havent got there yet. What a good owner should do is higher analytics guys at market rate. It is inane to me that with all the money in the sport they go cheap on the brainiacs.

Both you and spydy have good points, but counterpoint:

The cost to acquire and operate a foreign team would be a tiny fraction of the cost to operate (from what I could find online, most teams have total operating budgets <$20M). Even if you ran at a loss, it would about equal a backup point guard.

The age limit is only for the NBA draft. Most Euro teams have training squads with kids as young as 14. That gives you five years to coach a kid up your way and see if he's got what it takes with American style play and coaches that know your systems. You'd have day to day contact and improve your scouting knowledge tremendously.

If you're shady, you hold some of these guys out of competition to keep them under the radar. If you're slightly less shady, you sign them to contracts with huge buyouts, hoping that scares off other teams. If not, you make money selling them off to a team that drafts them.

Hell, you don't even have to buy the team - forge strategic alliances with certain teams. Hold half of training camp in Europe, scrimmage your teams (and use that as free scouting), build your brand internationally.

To me, it seems like the NBA is looking at international players the same way they look at players in the states - let colleges and AAU develop players (for free). The CBA has pretty much locked that avenue up.

Why not try to exploit a weakness - take the Moneyball approach. The A's didn't just sign guys with high on-base percentages because they're the best ballplayers, they signed them because those types of players were undervalued by the market.

Europe is (mostly) outside of the rules for now. They don't get the same coaching, they don't get the same training, they don't play the same style. Just seems to me a small investment by someone who's not afraid to be the first to move could pay huge dividends for a long time to come.