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Dion Waiters Traded

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Grade the Trade (Waiters + Kirk/Amundsen + 2nd rd pick for Smith, Shumpert, and 1st rd pick)

  • A+

    Votes: 18 7.1%
  • A

    Votes: 68 26.7%
  • B

    Votes: 106 41.6%
  • C

    Votes: 44 17.3%
  • D

    Votes: 10 3.9%
  • F

    Votes: 9 3.5%

  • Total voters
    255
  • Poll closed .
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Re: Welcome Dion Waiters

The person I was speaking with specifically pointed out that it wasn't "just a college kid thing."

Not gonna belabor the point. Was just curious if there was any truth to this.

On the spectrum of "great sign" to "oh shit", I'd put it just barely over the center line towards "oh shit" personally. It's not something I like to hear, that's for sure. I mean, yeah, I drank like a drunk in college and did some other stuff, too, but as a fan, I'm not evaluating Dion against me; I'm looking at him compared to other professional athletes.

It's not a huge concern, either. However, in the aggregate, there seem to be a decent number of things to excuse for the kid already.

Drinking? Give him a break! What kids in college don't drink?!

Weight concerns and conditioning? Give him a break! He stopped his pre-draft workouts. He'll learn what it takes to play in the NBA. Byron will have him ready.

Shooting and shot selection in Summer League? Give him a break! Jitters! New system. No PG. Just a slump. Summer League is completely meaningless.

Attitude? Give him a break! That's all behind him. Boeheim says so. (Actually, this is the one I'm most okay with BECAUSE of the Boeheim comments).

Height? Give him a break! He's an inch shorter than Beal, who's only an inch shorter than average SGs. Plus, height doesn't matter if the athleticism is there, and it will be after the aforementioned weight concerns are alleviated.

Negative Nancy posts like mine right here never go over well, and with good reason, given the fact that the first page of the book on Dion's NBA career has only a couple words still in wet ink on it. I don't even know if I'd even call what I feel "skepticism" at this point. It just seems that there are more minor concerns than usual this early in the honeymoon stage.
 
Re: Welcome Dion Waiters

Drafting Dion at #4 was a surprise. Fans having a "show me" attitude is not.
 
Re: Welcome Dion Waiters

Waiter's problem is never going to be that he's too thin. The danger with him will be if he starts dining with Raymond Felton.

Or Ben Roethlisberger...

<img src="http://teleburst.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/ben-roethlisberger-428cafe26d07.jpg">
 
Re: Welcome Dion Waiters

Read this the first time as Wade & Gerald Wallace and squirted a little out. That would be a helluva combo.

Wade and Gerald Wilkins is not that bad of a combo either.
 
Re: Welcome Dion Waiters

Dion Waiters (along with Zeller) is now eligible to be traded.

Message/avatar combo is enough to make folks sick-- Better get value like Harden out that numb fo' at minimum.
 
Re: Welcome Dion Waiters

From AC's latest blog. Had some interesting tidbits on AC's take on Dion. Mods move if the post is inappropriate for this thread.

Hey, Cleveland. It’s A.C., checking in from the offseason. I’ve been decompressing. Playing some golf. I’ll tell you more about it later.

The Cavs will be getting back into the gym soon. I liked a lot of what I saw during Summer League.

I thought Waiters showed he can get to the basket. He has good form on his outside shot; he just needs to work on it. And I think he has to understand that if he’s going to be a starter in this league, you’ll have to be in a little bit better shape.

And I think it’s a learning process for him.

He’s a competitor and I like that. He has a chip on shoulder, which is a good thing. He just needs to learn to control it. Just like when he called the timeout when we didn’t have one in the first game. You can’t get your head out of the game. You have to keep your head in the game at all times.

Summer League was a great learning experience for him to understand what he’s actually going to be involved in. Because when you’re the fourth player picked in the Draft – just like when I was the first player in the Draft – everybody’s gunning for you. You have to be in better condition than they are. And you have to be a better player. You have to think clearly. And all those things, he’ll learn.

On defense, he’s physically strong and quick enough to defend. It’s just a matter of the “want to.” If he wants to, he’ll be OK.

I also like the other rookie: Tyler Zeller. He’s going to be a solid player. He runs the floor well. Shoots the little 15-footer. He can almost play the big forward. And he shoots a hook shot!

I love it! I like his competitive spirit. The knock on him was that he’s a little soft. But I didn’t see it. He came ready to play.

Now – for the sophomores. Kyrie Irving goes into the season as the team’s unquestioned leader. And that’s going to be something new for him. But I think the team is ready for him to lead. And that’s very important.

He was close to perfect in his rookie season. Very few guys have had a first season like that. The only things he needs to work on are his stamina. He’s going to need that. He needs to understand also the pace that we need to play and win with. He needs to keep the pace up, even if he’s not scoring.

Last year, he was either all the way or nothing as far as pushing the ball and tempo. And the team starts to sag. When the team starts playing at that pace, they need to keep playing at that pace. And as the point, you need to be in the best condition on the floor. It’s as simple as that.

He needs to keep the tempo up and resist slowing it down. Byron doesn’t want that. He wants to defend and run. Rebound and run. Advance the ball, push the ball, get the ball to the right guy at the right time and take your shots when you’re open and have the opportunity.

It’ll be interesting to see how he works with Waiters. It’s going to have to be a meeting of the minds.

We have two guys who can beat you off the dribble now. So the offense won’t get stagnant. But the one thing that he has to understand is the importance of playing without the ball. Because Kyrie is going to penetrate and draw defenders to him, and Waiters has to be the floater – a Ray Allen-type guy – to hit the open jump shot.

That’s what I had to learn. I was always barreling to the basket. I thought I could take anybody in there. But you have to learn to be the off-guard. Be ready to hit that 15-footer. Catch-and-shoot, catch-and-shoot. I was used to attacking. In his position, he’s going to have to learn his spots: when to be there for Kyrie when he attracts the defense’s attention.

I also think Tristan’s going to have to take another big step. I think starting the last part of the season will help him tremendously – helped his confidence.

I hope in the offseason, he’s learned to shoot with an extended arm as opposed to always trying to shoot a half-hook, half-jump shot. He gets the position, but he gives up his advantage. And so once you have a guy pinned, you need to learn to shoot with an extended arm in order to maximize that position.

It’ll make life a lot easier for him. Because he does everything else pretty well.

You talk about speed. You have Andy, him, Zeller, a slimmed-down Samardo. Our big guys will be on the move.

He’s seen the whole NBA now, which is vital. Because first of all, you get a mental dictionary on each player. What he can do, what he can’t do. How he likes to guard you. As soon as you hear his name – BOOM! – you should have a picture of everything he does: Can’t go left well. Always drives to his right. Will pull up if you sag on him. Likes to turn his back. All those things you learn and store away as a rookie.

Kyrie should have a huge advantage this year. You also how certain teams like to defend: They double you in the post, they trap you on the wing. So now, you go into a game and you have a mental picture on how you want to attack and how they intend to defend you.

The key to success this year will be staying healthy. If Andy had stayed healthy, we’d have been fighting for the eighth spot, maybe even the seventh spot. If we stay healthy, we’ll surprise a lot of people this year. And the way you stay healthy, you get a good back up for Andy so you don’t have to play him too many extended minutes.

I think there’s going to be a power shift in the East this year. Even though Miami is the king.

I don’t see New York being a big player. I don’t think Carmelo and Amar’e co-exist well on the same team. Atlanta’s cleaning house. We can definitely sneak into the bottom half of the playoff pictures.

But you’re going to have to stay healthy. You‘re going to need big contributions from your rookies. Waiters will have to be a 10-15-ppg game man, and as a rookie, that’s tough. But it can be done. But you have to grow up fast.

But with an improved frontline, I think we’ll be a factor. Not a big factor, but not a pushover.

But all that will come in time. I’m going to enjoy my summer while I can. I’ve been unwinding a little bit. Playing a lot of golf.

I’ve played with Coach Scott early in the summer. But I’ll catch up with him again. It’s competitive when we’re out there. He can play too! It’s a good battle and t all depends on who’s playing well that day.

I like playing with Coach, but I play all over. I belong to a traveling league in the summer. We play all over. Canton, Youngstown, Lorain, Elyria.

Summer’s great but once the schedule comes out, I start getting my mind geared on the season.

It’s funny! You have a feeling of total freedom when the season is over. But once that schedule comes out, you start feeling like you have to get into that work mode. It’s time to move! I’m starting to ease back into that feeling. Once the weather starts cooling down, too.

That’s your life. You get used to being on the move. And there’s nothing like it.
 
Re: Welcome Dion Waiters

From AC's latest blog. Had some interesting tidbits on AC's take on Dion. Mods move if the post is inappropriate for this thread.

I'll tell you what... AC gets a bad rap from some for not exactly sounding overly astute at times, but the guy effing knows what he's talking about. Either that or he's got a hell of a basketball-saavy underling putting out these blog posts for him (mostly joking there; even underneath the occasional over-exuberance and stuttered/butchered wording, his basketball knowledge still tends to shine through).

This is probably the best editorial on the Cavs I've read all off-season, though I may just be saying that because I agree with almost all of it and I'm a total narcissist. Regardless, while I think AC gives Dion the benefit of the doubt in terms of improvement/corrections in the future for every issue, I think his overall assessment is just spot on. It's particularly interesting to read his perspective on Dion's need to learn to play off the ball, given his own experience and their similarities as players. I think this has to be the absolute biggest concern for Byron; can Dion be effective off the ball? Clearly, given Byron's stated position on drafting Dion, he thinks the answer is yes. I just hope he's right.

It's also interesting to read AC's thoughts on pace. He talks to Byron in addition to having his own opinions. We already know we want to run, but Byron may be ready to go full force on these guys in terms of getting them to run ALL THE TIME. AC is right about Kyrie being so starkly either all-on or all-off; and if Kyrie can get his conditioning to the point where every quarter is the fourth quarter, there really is no telling how good he can be in the current NBA as well as in a historical context.

Basically, AC just gave me a broner with images of the Cavs flying up and down the court, with one of the most mobile, if not THE most mobile, set of bigs in the NBA and perhaps soon the NBA's best PG. If Byron can get Dion to care off the ball and, more importantly, get his wind to the point where he can run alongside anybody, we will have a really fun team to watch, along with being one that will run a few better teams off the court every once in a while, too.
 
Re: Welcome Dion Waiters

I ran a route in Cleveland last Thursday and I just so happened to take the call of Byrons golfing partner. We were discussing the Cavs and I mentioned how I wasn't sure how I felt about Dion Waiters being that I didn't know much about him before the pick. He says that Byron is not only completely sold on him but in fact puts him in the same circle of up and coming players that he has coached in the past which includes Kyrie and Chris Paul. I'm suppose to go back on Monday or Tuesday and they were suppose to golf this weekend. Byron landed on Wed. and I was hoping to ask this guy about Byrons assessment of Waiters after summer league but it looks like the two may have not met due to weather restrictions.

In any case, he does say that Byron has the complete respect of his players and is well liked. Something I wasn't sure of but now I am.

Edit: He also said Byron is the best shooter on the team. Come shooting practice, no one holds a candle. :chuckles:
 
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Re: 17th Pick - Tyler Zeller

I doubt the Cavs had Beal ranked behind Waiters. Beal and MKG were both freshman, while Waiters, Barnes, and Lamb were all sophomores BECAUSE they had disappointing freshman seasons. There's a reason why freshman went #1, #2, and #3. The fact Waiters can handle the ball is a nice consolation prize, but that's all. You could say at his size, it's a necessity and even Beal was talking about working on that part of his game so he might be able to play some PG.

I will agree with you about the freshman/sophomore thing, but Waiters has real playmaking skills. I was really surprised by that. Great vision for a 2 guard.
 
Re: Welcome Dion Waiters

I ran a route in Cleveland last Thursday and I just so happened to take the call of Byrons golfing partner. We were discussing the Cavs and I mentioned how I wasn't sure how I felt about Dion Waiters being that I didn't know much about him before the pick. He says that Byron is not only completely sold on him but in fact puts him in the same circle of up and coming players that he has coached in the past which includes Kyrie and Chris Paul. I'm suppose to go back on Monday or Tuesday and they were suppose to golf this weekend. Byron landed on Wed. and I was hoping to ask this guy about Byrons assessment of Waiters after summer league but it looks like the two may have not met due to weather restrictions.

In any case, he does say that Byron has the complete respect of his players and is well liked. Something I wasn't sure of but now I am.

Edit: He also said Byron is the best shooter on the team. Come shooting practice, no one holds a candle. :chuckles:

So the source for Scott having the complete respect of all his players, and being the best shooter on the team is................. Byron Scott himself?

Scott also told me he is by far the most humble guy in the organization, and it isn't even a contest. :chuckles:
 
Re: 17th Pick - Tyler Zeller

I will agree with you about the freshman/sophomore thing, but Waiters has real playmaking skills. I was really surprised by that. Great vision for a 2 guard.

I like that Dion has some play-making abilities, but it also raises questions about how well he'll play off of someone better than him.

Anyway, the point here is that if this was Waiters' freshman season, he wouldn't have even been in the discussion. He improved in a number of areas, and we can only project where Beal would have been if he stayed.
 
Re: 17th Pick - Tyler Zeller

I think Dion and Kyrie will work well together. Kyrie is a dead eye shooter for a PG and if Dion handles the ball and let Kyrie play off of it during the game, it just makes both a lethal combination. Kyrie will open up lanes for Dion and Dion will get Kyrie open looks. And both can penetrate at will which will definitely disrupt the other teams defense. I hope the back court works out and if it does, daaaayyyyeeeemmmm!!!!!
 
Re: 17th Pick - Tyler Zeller

I like that Dion has some play-making abilities, but it also raises questions about how well he'll play off of someone better than him.

Anyway, the point here is that if this was Waiters' freshman season, he wouldn't have even been in the discussion. He improved in a number of areas, and we can only project where Beal would have been if he stayed.

It is easier, however to learn how to play off the ball than it is to play on the ball and be a playmaker. From what I've hearx and seen from his college play, he is at least average at playing off the ball. It's a good thing we have Kyrie to teach Dion how to be just a sick nasty guard.
 
Re: 17th Pick - Tyler Zeller

It is easier, however to learn how to play off the ball than it is to play on the ball and be a playmaker. From what I've hearx and seen from his college play, he is at least average at playing off the ball. It's a good thing we have Kyrie to teach Dion how to be just a sick nasty guard.

Well, it's not like Beal never passed or drove. He averaged 2.2 apg his freshman year, Waiters was only at 1.6 apg because he was limited to just 16.3 mpg. Waiters is ahead of Beal when it comes to creating for others off the P&R, but tbd whether he'll be able to do the things he could do at the NCAA level .vs. NBA defenders.
 
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