Love/Wiggins Trade Revisited

[Chris]

Dude is averaging 19-5 as a rookie (since the cavs game. This is with weak handles and while getting double teamed as of the last month. He will be a 25ppg guy with very good within 3 years as long as he can get his handles to average level.

How are his stats that actually portend his future? Ie his advanced stats.

 

[Chris]

I saw one poster say he's not convinced Wiggins will be a stud. He did not say that Wiggins won't or can't be, but rather that poster is not quick to jump to conclusions about a rookie. And another poster said he doesn't think he'll ever average 25 ppg in a season. Most/many perennial all-stars don't ever average 25 ppg.

Are these recent posts really all that critical or awful?

edited to add: I'm pretty neutral on this topic. I think Wiggins will be very good (anywhere from a good two-way player who is an all-star a couple years, to a perennial all-star with a couple monster years; although I'm not sure of his ability to be option 1-A on a team that wins it all, but I'd say that about 99% of the league), yet odds are good the trade will have worked out very well for us given where Love and Wiggins are at in their careers and what we need RIGHT NOW with LBJ in his prime.

Yeah, oddly enough, I was one of the Wiggins guys and I wish we could gave kept him.

That does not mean I think he is going to be a perennial All Star based on a PPG stat his rookie year on a squad barren of talent. I would have thought i wouldnt have to explain to Cavs fans that predicting a guy to be a megastar based on his PPG is absurdity, but here we are.

 

[Deezus]

He will be a 25ppg guy with very good within 3 years

...So you're saying that he will be as good as Kevin Love was last year within 3 years? Glad we traded him then to maximize Lebron's prime.

 

[gourimoko]

If you wanted to compare Kevin Love and Wiggins it seems like you'd also have to factor in that Wiggins output would decrease if he is playing with LeBron and Kyrie. He might get more open looks but he would be called on to score less and there could be a lot of issues with the 3 of them all wanting to handle the ball and create shots.

Wiggins would be the third or even fourth option on offense in Cleveland. His output might decrease but his efficiency would surely be better.

He's almost always guarded by the opposing team's best defender and often double teamed when playing on the ball in isolation.

That wouldn't happen if he were in Cleveland.

 

[gourimoko]

How are his stats that actually portend his future? Ie his advanced stats.

Many of his advanced stats are damaged by the fact that his team is one of the worst in the league; which hurts his plus/minus derived aggregate statistics.

His PER is wildly erratic... It's hard to say what we can derive from simple averages.

 

[Kizzle]

Wiggins' numbers are a product of his role in Minny. On any playoff team he's probably a third option. Don't underreact because he's clearly ROY but don't go all out predicting 25ppg unless your also gonna acknowledge that if he does hit that number it will be on a horrible team

 

[Chris]

Many of his advanced stats are damaged by the fact that his team is one of the worst in the league; which hurts his plus/minus derived aggregate statistics.

His PER is wildly erratic... It's hard to say what we can derive from simple averages.

And if that continues, we could probably insinuate he may not be a #1 option megastar that people are already anointing him based on his "points per game averages over the last two months."

That said, I'll repeat...I wanted Wiggins last June (as you did). And honestly I wish him the best...it'll suck if he turns out really, really good unless Love stays with the Cavs and we win titles, because I'll wish Wiggins was on here, but I'm not gonna root against him because of that. Seems like a good guy. I wish him the best. /end cliches

But as of right now, I'm mildly impressed, but not writing home about anything.

 

[InBoobieWeTrust]

Wiggins would be the third or even fourth option on offense in Cleveland. His output might decrease but his efficiency would surely be better.

He's almost always guarded by the opposing team's best defender and often double teamed when playing on the ball in isolation.

That wouldn't happen if he were in Cleveland.

Or he could have never even gotten the reps to improve his game to a level where he would even play meaningful minutes for a contender. The Wiggins from early on was a lost puppy who was a net negative on the court, after a lot of reps, he started stringing together some better games. I don't agree with this assertion at all.

 

[gourimoko]

Or he could have never even gotten the reps to improve his game to a level where he would even play meaningful minutes for a contender. The Wiggins from early on was a lost puppy who was a net negative on the court, after a lot of reps, he started stringing together some better games. I don't agree with this assertion at all.

Wiggins would have had a more stable system, something he thrived in in college. I think the reason he was so bad to start the season was because he had an entire professional franchise thrust upon him.

I don't think, had he been playing next to LeBron and Kyrie, that he would have never achieved his potential.

In fact, I think he'd have excelled the same way Irving is excelling now.

 

[BimboColesHair]

Many of his advanced stats are damaged by the fact that his team is one of the worst in the league; which hurts his plus/minus derived aggregate statistics.

His PER is wildly erratic... It's hard to say what we can derive from simple averages.

Being on a shitty team didn't exactly hurt Kyrie's advanced stats his rookie year, but the Cavs were just a little less shitty than the Wolves. Somehow he pulled in the same DBPM, -1.7, that Wiggins is currently posting too. Then again, Kyrie had one of the better rookie years in recent memory. Shoot, even Love's rookie year, which people deemed as a slight disappointment, was much better than Wiggins' going off advanced stats, and that Wolves team was awful too.

I've been asking myself for a few weeks now if Wiggins will ever be as good or better than Kyrie. It's interesting to bring up because it would mean if Wiggins was here, he'd be locked in as a 3rd option for the foreseeable future, and for all we know it hurts his development as a player. Part of the reason I continue to see this as a huge win/win trade for all parties (as long as Love stays that is).

 

[gourimoko]

I've been asking myself for a few weeks now if Wiggins will ever be as good or better than Kyrie.

Honest question...

Will Kevin Love ever be as good or better than Kyrie?

 

[BimboColesHair]

Honest question...

Will Kevin Love ever be as good or better than Kyrie?

He was better than Kyrie has ever been last year...but on this team? Doubt it.

 

[gourimoko]

He was better than Kyrie has ever been last year...but on this team? Doubt it.

Was he?

I think if this really were true, then it would be self-evident this year with them both sharing the same floor.

 

[Chris]

Was he?

I think if this really were true, then it would be self-evident this year with them both sharing the same floor.

Seeing as he was... a far better player than Kyrie last year, yes, he was. Not sure I understand your questioning of it. The dynamic is totally different when you put them both on the same team, and then add in LeBron freakin' James. I'll also go ahead and say it: Love isn't remotely close to 100%. I think that goes without saying at this point.

 

[gourimoko]

Seeing as he was... a far better player than Kyrie last year, yes, he was. Not sure I understand your questioning of it. The dynamic is totally different when you put them both on the same team, and then add in LeBron freakin' James. I'll also go ahead and say it: Love isn't remotely close to 100%. I think that goes without saying at this point.

He was better because he had better stats?

I'm guessing you don't think that stats can be "empty?" Or....?