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Seattle Seahawks @ Cleveland Browns (1:00PM - CBS)

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Eh...measurables are garbage IMO. Measurables are the reason Aaron Rodgers wasn't recruited and Tom Brady went in the 6th round. It's also why Drew Brees was forced out of San Diego. Colt has enough skill and arm strength to succeed in the NFL. I know he doesn't have a Manning arm, but neither do Brees or Brady. Being an NFL QB is largely about intangibles and confidence. Colt has zero confidence right now and he's suffering from it.

A better offense around could certainly help his confidence. A better run game could take some pressure off of him. A true #1 receiver that demands a double team could open up a lot of throws for him. There's a plethora of issues/reasons he's struggling right now, and there's a lot of fixes for those problems too.

I still don;t know if Colt is the answer at QB. I really like his make-up and competiveness though. I think he could be a good NFL QB with a decent roster around him. Right now the offense is a mess. I don't know how anyone could say differently.

Colt has not shown even close to the arm strength necessary to succeed at the NFL level.

I mean, not even in the vicinity at this point.

Are we banking on him getting stronger? I for one, am not.
 
The spread offense is designed around quick throws and often times hitting guys on crossing patterns. It doesn't mean the spread is = to the WCO. You are WAY off-base on this assumption. Any time a team unloads the backfield in favor of 4 wide sets, they are going to count on quick throws. Again, quick throws doesn't make it similar to WCO. In the WCO you're often using 2 wide-sets, mostly under center, and moving the defense so you can work intermediate throws underneath. At Texas they used 4 wide sets, spread the DB's, forced nickel db packages, and exploited mismatches based on what they saw pre-snap from the defense.

Colt also took 95% of his snaps from Shot-gun. Similar to what Tebow did at UF. Neither Tebow or McCoy played in anything similar to the WCO. And Tebow's spread offense was nothing like McCoy's. My overall point is you can't claim McCoy has played in a system similar to the WCO just because he played in a system that relied on intermediate and quick throws.

Colt also worked from 4 wide sets and rarely used play-action. He never went under center. He also played in a reactionary offense, meaning he/Texas would make multiple line calls depending on what the defense looked like. The WCO predominately forces the defense into calls. I promise you that Colt made a hell of a lot more line calls at Texas than he does under Shurmur.

Your premise is faulty.

I don't care what the differences in the offense were. The point is that Colt was largely successful with short and intermediate crossing patterns. Now at the NFL level Colt can't even accurately make these throws, that's a huge warning sign.
 
The one thing I don't get...

Last year Colt was throwing terrific passes at 20 and 30 yards. At this point, I can't recall the last time he even attempted a throw in that range and even gave his receiver a chance at the ball.

What the hell happened?
 
Who cares about arm strength? It's all about intagibles.
 
I don't care what the differences in the offense were. The point is that Colt was largely successful with short and intermediate crossing patterns. Now at the NFL level Colt can't even accurately make these throws, that's a huge warning sign.

There are a lot of warning signs with Colt, that being included. But he is also in a brand new system, hasn't started an entire season yet, and has one of the worst offensive supporting casts in the NFL. His current RB didn't play a down of football last year. Hillis is a mess. And our best receiver is a second round draft pick.

Again, Colt hasn't looked good this year. But this season isn't surprising in the least to me. He has regressed a shitload after closing last year pretty well. But I said it in the Browns thread coming into the season. I thought Colt was getting a raw deal when they didn't sign any skill players that would make his job easier. I also thought the new system would be a tough transition.

And I disagree with Boobie on the arm strength. Colt has a weak arm, but it can work IMO. Tom Brady has a weak arm too. I don't think anybody in their right mind would think Tom Brady could have succeeded in the NFL with his arm strength but he makes it work with intangibles. BTW, the Patriots offense is MUCH closer to what Colt ran at Texas.

And I'd also like to add one point as well. For every throw I see him complete on a three yard crossing pattern, I see balls forced to receivers 5 yards downfield that are draped. He is missing some throws, but he's also forcing a lot of balls, and eating the football when players are covered as well. I think this entire system needs a lot of over-hauling and it starts with players learning it and having talent. This offense is terrible beyond Colt. Whether we displace Colt or not, there are holes everywhere on offense that need plugged.
 
There are a lot of warning signs with Colt, that being included. But he is also in a brand new system, hasn't started an entire season yet, and has one of the worst offensive supporting casts in the NFL. His current RB didn't play a down of football last year. Hillis is a mess. And our best receiver is a second round draft pick.

Again, Colt hasn't looked good this year. But this season isn't surprising in the least to me. He has regressed a shitload after closing last year pretty well. But I said it in the Browns thread coming into the season. I thought Colt was getting a raw deal when they didn't sign any skill players that would make his job easier. I also thought the new system would be a tough transition.

And I disagree with Boobie on the arm strength. Colt has a weak arm, but it can work IMO. Tom Brady has a weak arm too. I don't think anybody in their right mind would think Tom Brady could have succeeded in the NFL with his arm strength but he makes it work with intangibles. BTW, the Patriots offense is MUCH closer to what Colt ran at Texas.

Tom Brady has a weak arm? Lol. Maybe the dumbest statement ever posted on RCF.
 
Tom Brady has a friggin cannon. Go back to the Super Bowl against the Giants where he kept trying to connect with Moss on those Hail Mary plays. Colt's passes get knocked down by the wind.
 
The one thing I don't get...

Last year Colt was throwing terrific passes at 20 and 30 yards. At this point, I can't recall the last time he even attempted a throw in that range and even gave his receiver a chance at the ball.

What the hell happened?

He looked pretty good in pre-season too. But then again, it is pre-season.
 
something that bothers me is how dawson can nail those 50+ yard fg's like it's no big deal, but all of his kickoffs are right at the goal line and returnable. Where is that big leg that he shows off kicking the ball through the uprights?
 
one good takeaway from the game is TJ ward's play. He did have that one breakdown in coverage where he lost sidney rice but apart from that he was great at the LoS, had a huge play with the sack fumble, and looked pretty good in coverage. He also had what turned out to be one of the big plays of the game when he broke up the 3rd and goal pass.
 
He looked pretty good in pre-season too. But then again, it is pre-season.
This is what's baffling me. Yeah, it's pre-season, but he was throwing the ball with terrific accuracy. Against GB he fit a ball between 5 defenders. Where the hell did that go? :chuckles:
 
This is what's baffling me. Yeah, it's pre-season, but he was throwing the ball with terrific accuracy. Against GB he fit a ball between 5 defenders. Where the hell did that go? :chuckles:

I think the difference is that defenses are aggressively sending pressure at him, something they didn't do in the pre-season. And as we all know, mccoy is completely different under pressure
 
There are a lot of warning signs with Colt, that being included. But he is also in a brand new system, hasn't started an entire season yet, and has one of the worst offensive supporting casts in the NFL. His current RB didn't play a down of football last year. Hillis is a mess. And our best receiver is a second round draft pick.

Most of the best passing teams have WRs drafted in the 2nd round or later at WR:
Mike Wallace 3rd round
Wes Welker undrafted
Greg Jennings 2nd round
Brandon Marshall 4th round
Marques Colston 7th round
Stevie Johnson 7th round
Sidney Rice 2nd round
DeSean Jackson 2nd round
Miles Austin undrafted

to name a few. Great QBs make great receivers, it generally doesn't work the other way around. Fitzgerald is arguably the most talented wide receiver in the NFL, but when Derek Anderson was his QB, he was hardly a factor. I'm not ready to write Colt of either, but, at worst, he has an average supporting cast around him. I'd much rather work with what the Browns have than the Bills, but somehow Fitzpatrick is getting things done. You could also make a case for the weaknesses in Brees' targets... none has elite size or speed except for Meachem, and he's a headcase. They make tons of plays with the likes of Colston, Sproles and Moore, all of whom have glaring weaknesses. Jimmy Graham is a great talent, and is utilized often, but without him they'd still have Drew Brees.

Again, Colt hasn't looked good this year. But this season isn't surprising in the least to me. He has regressed a shitload after closing last year pretty well. But I said it in the Browns thread coming into the season. I thought Colt was getting a raw deal when they didn't sign any skill players that would make his job easier. I also thought the new system would be a tough transition.

I agree with this premise, though I think Colt has looked worse than I had expected (hoped). The troubling thing is, he's getting worse on a game-by-game basis. That strikes me as a mental issue, and may not be something he snaps out of. Hopefully he gains some confidence after this win and starts to turn it back around.

And I disagree with Boobie on the arm strength. Colt has a weak arm, but it can work IMO. Tom Brady has a weak arm too. I don't think anybody in their right mind would think Tom Brady could have succeeded in the NFL with his arm strength but he makes it work with intangibles. BTW, the Patriots offense is MUCH closer to what Colt ran at Texas.

People forget Brady had a noodle arm coming out of college. However, Brady had a frame to build on, and physically matured late. I don't think we'll be as lucky with Colt. I don't think Brady's arm strength is a big question mark anymore. He might not have Manning's cannon, but it's close enough. We're also going to be a WCO team, and if Colt can't adapt, he's not our guy.

And I'd also like to add one point as well. For every throw I see him complete on a three yard crossing pattern, I see balls forced to receivers 5 yards downfield that are draped. He is missing some throws, but he's also forcing a lot of balls, and eating the football when players are covered as well. I think this entire system needs a lot of over-hauling and it starts with players learning it and having talent. This offense is terrible beyond Colt. Whether we displace Colt or not, there are holes everywhere on offense that need plugged.

I don't think throwing to receivers 5 yards down field is going to do much to stretch a defense. Like it or not, Little and Massaqoui are good enough to get NFL caliber separation. McCoy is often throwing his passes before his WRs running intermediate routes even make a cut, which means he's panicking. There are a lot of holes, including playcalling, and we don't have a Superbowl caliber offense by any stretch of the imagination. We do, however, have the weapons necessary to put up 20-some odd points on passing defenses as terrible as the Seahawks are. Especially with Trufant out. The only reason it didn't get done in this game rests squarely on McCoy. He has to get better.
 
I don't know what happened to Colt but last year all I remember saying was, "Wow, what a pass, helluva arm!".

I feel bad because we've all witnessed this kids potential. He CAN do it. He just isn't. I think he's going to be one of those guys who's light switch flips later on in their career. Now is not his time.
 

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