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Ex Indians update

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Gson said:
Proven player > unproven prospects.. most of the time..
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Agreed but the 2nd part of the analysis is what some people leave out .... sum of WAR of proven player for years under current contract is most likely much less sum of WAR of all unproven prospects traded for (before their FA hits). Otherwise, Guardians would be a crappy system trading away proven players who have more value than prospects. Otherwise, FOs would be a fool to just give away their players and upset their fan bases. Otherwise, the whole stock market system that pays people for waiting for asset values to appreciate would collapse (in other words, why FO are rewarded for waiting on prospects to mature -- get more for younger prospects than those about MLB ready).

There are thousands of trades that are meaningless .... there are hundreds of trades favoring the proven mlb player (Millers) ... but there are more trades where prospects are forgotten about until it all clicks ... Yordan Alvarez, Clase, Kluber and maybe Junior Caminero.

And unfortunately, each side of this argument can show hundreds of trades to prove their point in an attempt to be right (even me with that list above).
 
Just so I don't gum up another thread with needless back-and-forth banter. Yet, I always look for those that got away from Cleveland. A few will point to Alex Call breakout in August with Washington. Now, it is too early to know for sure as pitchers adjust and no one was really scouting Washington in-depth at the time (probably) especially their bottom hitter (so he may have avoid a bit of scrutiny). Yet, the one thing that stood out to me is his power potential (or lack there of) in some stadiums.

He had .237/.336/.412/.748 line which is good with the poor start in Cleveland (1 for 12 with 2 walks). But, what stood out is of his 5 HRs only 1 would have been out of the park in Cleveland due to our LF wall (per BSavant). If those 4 HRs are now all doubles, his slugging % goes down to .342 (70 point decline). Now, he may have been on the road vs home for those games with us but his spray chart shows a very heavy dependency on LF pull power that pitchers will start to learn and probably pitching him away more (maybe finding his kryptonite).

Yet, even if he does succeed elsewhere, this is another story of probably why our analytic department doesn't hold righties as the same value as lefties and switch hitters as our park doesn't play to that weaker pull power with the wall (kind of compares to Baltimore - where Mancini 18 HR last year in Balt would have been 18 with us but a whopping 37 in Cinci).
 
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Clevinger under investigation for domestic violence.
 
CATS44 said:
Once Clevs name came up on the periphery of the Bauer saga, teams should have been wary.
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I get it but all the info on the matter was her statements

About the time of her first sexual encounter with Bauer, the woman said in a message to her cousin: “Trevor is a wackadoodle like Clev.” That message, and the one mentioning Tatis, were not included in the woman’s request for a restraining order. She reluctantly identified Clev as Clevinger. The woman claims her dealing with Tatis was not something she would put in the relationship category. When asked about her relationship with Clevinger, the woman replied, “He doesn’t need to be brought into this.”

I guess Wack.... means something now. But, if it was serious improprieties, would she have brought him into it? Is Tatis now under suspicion -- even though they did not have a "relationship" just like Clinton did not have ... well you know?
 
MLB and the teams have huge investigative powers.

Plus with so many former Guardian players and personnel spread throughout the league, it isn't difficult to get first hand opinions on any former Guardian player.

Hanging with Bauer was a red flag. Having his name come up in the Bauer situation was an even bigger red flag.

Chicago ignored both, and even extolled Clevs character in the introductory presser.

Teams are taking much bigger media hits over stuff like this than used to be. In the past beat writers were basically team cheerleaders, and national writers stuck to the game. Investigative journalism within the sporting world was unknown. Even if a writer knew about off the field impropriety, he didn't print it.

Not so today. The team gets blamed for its lack of vetting when it brings in a miscreant. The White Sox are taking a beating now for signing Clevinger, esp after Larussa's DUI came to light after he was rehired as the manager.

There are already columns out that insist that Clevinger never pitch in MLB again...and the connection to Bauer is being made more public.

The court of public opinion may be unfair, but its the way it is. Even worse for Clevinger is that he is being labeled as a child abuser. As we've seen in various threads over the last 18 months, there is a segment of society that will support Bauers actions, but nobody supports child abuse...even if the 'abuse' is questionable.
 
CATS44 said:
Once Clevs name came up on the periphery of the Bauer saga, teams should have been wary.
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Makes me wonder if the Angels knew something when they let him go for so little.
 
petes999 said:
I get it but all the info on the matter was her statements

About the time of her first sexual encounter with Bauer, the woman said in a message to her cousin: “Trevor is a wackadoodle like Clev.” That message, and the one mentioning Tatis, were not included in the woman’s request for a restraining order. She reluctantly identified Clev as Clevinger. The woman claims her dealing with Tatis was not something she would put in the relationship category. When asked about her relationship with Clevinger, the woman replied, “He doesn’t need to be brought into this.”

I guess Wack.... means something now. But, if it was serious improprieties, would she have brought him into it? Is Tatis now under suspicion -- even though they did not have a "relationship" just like Clinton did not have ... well you know?
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So your timeline is a little more accurate than CATS. Clevinger and Tatis were long before (if you can call anything long in todays relationship space) Bauer with this pack of girls. And Bauer was much more as a result of Clevinger's association with them than the other way around. Something like - if you want to get back at someone go after their friends or family.

The girl accusing Clevinger, and I am not trying to say the accusations are justified or not, ran with the same pack as Lindsey Hill (Bauer accuser). Besties one might say. So Clev has dipped into this group of girls more than once, knowing that there could be some questionable repercussions. I guess the old saying is - play with fire, and you get burned
 
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