2020 NBA Draft

[Cavatt]

That's certainly his archetype, but it seems highly unlikely he ever sniffs that level

Granted development is not linear, but when Amar'e was Toppin's age he was a top 10 player in the league and averaged 37 and 10 in the WCF.

It doesn't mean Toppin can't get there, but it's unlikely.

Wow hard to believe a guy without a 3pt shot could average that if his name isn't Shaq.

Stoudemire was the poster boy for successful microfracture surgery, but it didn't last too long.

As to your point, yeah, Toppin would have to improve significantly very quickly to even get into that convo.

 

[DeeThree]

I'm saying Toppin is that mold of a player, that archetype. Not saying he will produce the same.

 

[Ozone]

I'm saying Toppin is that mold of a player, that archetype. Not saying he will produce the same.

if your point is Obi is also a low effort defender I can see the comparsion ,might even argue Obi is better defensively although that aint much of a compliment. Other than a similar power game inside Amare was better offensively at same age.

 

[pinoycavsfan]

2020 Wing Prospects

 

[Ozone]

Neither Edwards nor Okoro do enough offensively with KPJ on board to really justify it top 2 but after that I would consider either and Vassel who all have differing levels of floor . I would not pass on Okongwu though at this point in the predraft process for a different defender unless they had a lot higher ceiling offensively as well and i am not sold they do.

 

[RichieRichPaul]

Killian Hayes should be the pick. He can pass, dribble, defend, has size and his shooting has improved every year he’s played

 

[Derek]

Hayes is probably my favorite guy in the draft. I think he’d fit well next to Sexton or Garland, but not both.

It will be interesting to see what we do this off-season.

 

[I'mWithDan]

After stepping away from draft stuff, with the season ending, I think the guy I tend to cast aside the data on is Okoro.

I watched 5-6 Auburn games and just the things he does contribute to winning basketball. He can guard all 3 levels, he's really competitive, he's incredibly stout both on ball and off it, creative when driving, a strong finisher and a pretty underrated passer.

The huge concern is his shooting........in terms of becoming an All-Star type player......but he seems to have everything else: All-around play, size, speed, athleticism, motor, smarts.

He's improved tremendously as a late bloomer......and he seems like the guy to bet on if the Cavs end up in the 6 range, and the top guys on their board are gone.

 

[Ozone]

Killian Hayes should be the pick. He can pass, dribble, defend, has size and his shooting has improved every year he’s played

umm if he cant pass dribble defend ?There isn't a lottery projected guard that can't do all 3 of those at the same level.
Pretty vague reasoning is my point. I like Hayes as a medium high upside offensive player not a 2way player given his size for a combo guard he has some appeal as a big point esp given his court vision is lottery level worthy along with a decent bevy of finshes but they are 90% left hand dominant and easy to predict. He does also have quite a few dribble step back moves if that shot starts falling consistently but it aint lottery worthy compared to the likes of Cole Anthony or Halliburton. But there again Hayes is not the level of elite explosive athlete that can overcome that left side issue without serious development and going right a lot more. His defense up until this point has been meh to bad and not just due to mental limitations which are a bigger issue given the sell on him is his high iq as a floor general ,but more often the defense suffers based on lack of athleticim and projects to be good only on paper based on decent size and not much else to back it up.
I think he is in the same boat as Ball with less hype but both being somewhat overrated as high lottery targets because they have solid ball skills and above average pg size Ball showing he can score alot on a high usage situation against bad competition and Hayes being average at best but getting a pass for doing it against much better defenses.I dont think I would touch either one without some other options already gone.

 

[Cavatt]

After stepping away from draft stuff, with the season ending, I think the guy I tend to cast aside the data on is Okoro.

I watched 5-6 Auburn games and just the things he does contribute to winning basketball. He can guard all 3 levels, he's really competitive, he's incredibly stout both on ball and off it, creative when driving, a strong finisher and a pretty underrated passer.

The huge concern is his shooting........in terms of becoming an All-Star type player......but he seems to have everything else: All-around play, size, speed, athleticism, motor, smarts.

He's improved tremendously as a late bloomer......and he seems like the guy to bet on if the Cavs end up in the 6 range, and the top guys on their board are gone.

I really love him. I think he can be really good. The shooting stuff doesn't bother me much anymore. It seems like most guys can become passable shooters. There are some strange outliers where it has haunted them their whole career. MKG, Derozan, and Evan Turner al lcome to mind.

His mind is so good and you see it with his passes and defensive anticipation. He is so good using his body around the rim too.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

After stepping away from draft stuff, with the season ending, I think the guy I tend to cast aside the data on is Okoro.

I watched 5-6 Auburn games and just the things he does contribute to winning basketball. He can guard all 3 levels, he's really competitive, he's incredibly stout both on ball and off it, creative when driving, a strong finisher and a pretty underrated passer.

The huge concern is his shooting........in terms of becoming an All-Star type player......but he seems to have everything else: All-around play, size, speed, athleticism, motor, smarts.

He's improved tremendously as a late bloomer......and he seems like the guy to bet on if the Cavs end up in the 6 range, and the top guys on their board are gone.

I haven't seen any of these guys play a single minute, but I liked your write-up because it acknowledge both positives and negatives. If what you said is accurate, I'd be fine with him given that there don't seem to be any sure things anyway in this draft. And we absolutely need some defense.

 

[Cavatt]

I haven't seen any of these guys play a single minute, but I liked your write-up because it acknowledge both positives and negatives. If what you said is accurate, I'd be fine with him given that there don't seem to be any sure things anyway in this draft. And we absolutely need some defense.

He's a guy I think you would like. He has great anticipation skill on plays and sees what is coming. Probably not a Thybulle type of defender, but projects to be able to guard 1-4 with strength.

The first thing I thought when I saw him was on offense. I think he is going to be a special finisher. He has that low base that can't be thrown off balance and he is always under control going to the basket even when going full speed. People say he is a straight line driver, but he has more wiggle than that, and his handle is not flashy, but effective. I think in NBA he has more room to operate, and will draw fouls. I think you asked how he was different from KPJ one time. His biggest similarity to KPJ is his finishing around the basket with strength and balance in my opinion.

All his upside is in his shooting. If he could shoot, he would be a "do it all guy" who might have potential to have the ball in his hands. His playmaking is good, but didn't show up a lot in the stats because the ball wasn't in his hands in college. Seems to have a high IQ for where he and others are on the floor on both sides of the ball. Those 2 skills playmaking and shooting are areas that if he improves he starts to be a really exciting player instead of a guy off the bench for defense and to play the cutter/driver role.

He's raw offensively, but I think the upside is there. Importantly, he fits the hard work culture of Sexton and KPJ. Problem is he and KPJ are both in that 6'5" area and neither is 6'8". One other thing I will mention defensively is he is not just a quiet defender like Kawhi. He is a vocal guy and might be more like Tristan. I think our team could really benefit from his presence, but it could cause trouble in the rotation.

 

[DeeThree]

Need more posts.

 

[Nathan S]

Here's a comparison of four of the top wings in this draft (per-100 stats):


Okoro: 19.4 years old, 6'6" 225 lbs, 23.2 points, .51/.29/.67 shooting, 8.0 boards, 3.7 assists, 1.7 steals, 1.6 blocks, 3.5 turnovers, 4.9 fouls

Vassell: 19.8 years old, 6'6" 180 lbs, 25.3 points, .49/.42/.74 shooting, 10.1 boards, 3.3 assists, 2.8 steals, 1.9 blocks, 1.5 turnovers, 3.9 fouls

Green: 19.6 years old, 6'6" 210 lbs, 22.1 points, .42/.36/.78 shooting, 8.4 boards, 4.8 assists, 2.8 steals, 0.8 blocks, 3.0 turnovers, 4.5 fouls

Hampton: 19.3 years old, 6'5", 185 lbs, 22.7 points, .41/.30/.68 shooting, 10.1 boards, 6.1 assists, 2.8 steals, 0.8 blocks, 4.0 turnovers, 4.9 fouls


Okoro has a few things going for him, in particular his excellent frame which he uses very well to score efficiently inside the arc. But I'm a bit confused as to how he soared from mid-30's recruit to consensus lottery pick. I was team-Okoro early in the year, but don't see the argument for him now considering that at least one of Vassell/Green/Hampton will probably be available in the late teens of this draft. How would you all rank these guys?

 

[Cavatt]

Here's a comparison of four of the top wings in this draft (per-100 stats):


Okoro: 19.4 years old, 6'6" 225 lbs, 23.2 points, .51/.29/.67 shooting, 8.0 boards, 3.7 assists, 1.7 steals, 1.6 blocks, 3.5 turnovers, 4.9 fouls

Vassell: 19.8 years old, 6'6" 180 lbs, 25.3 points, .49/.42/.74 shooting, 10.1 boards, 3.3 assists, 2.8 steals, 1.9 blocks, 1.5 turnovers, 3.9 fouls

Green: 19.6 years old, 6'6" 210 lbs, 22.1 points, .42/.36/.78 shooting, 8.4 boards, 4.8 assists, 2.8 steals, 0.8 blocks, 3.0 turnovers, 4.5 fouls

Hampton: 19.3 years old, 6'5", 185 lbs, 22.7 points, .41/.30/.68 shooting, 10.1 boards, 6.1 assists, 2.8 steals, 0.8 blocks, 4.0 turnovers, 4.9 fouls


Okoro has a few things going for him, in particular his excellent frame which he uses very well to score efficiently inside the arc. But I'm a bit confused as to how he soared from mid-30's recruit to consensus lottery pick. I was team-Okoro early in the year, but don't see the argument for him now considering that at least one of Vassell/Green/Hampton will probably be available in the late teens of this draft. How would you all rank these guys?

They are closer than you would think.

I really like Okoro. I just think I see a super high level finisher from him. His passing is intriguing, and yeah his body and defensive instincts are great. His shot is questionable, but I don't think it is totally broken. FT% gives no confidence.

Vassell is so good, just hounds people even though he is not the athlete or physique of Okoro. He's a super safe pick IMO. Great floor, maybe higher than Okoro. I do think he is mainly a 3 and D though. More defenive minded Wes Matthews I think. Love to have him on the team, would not take in the top 5 where I would take Okoro at 5.

Hampton is cool, but as good as an athlete or at least functional athlete is my issue. I don't think he uses his body as effectively as he could. He looks liek Exum to me where he is supposed to be athletic, but doesn't seem that quick. I'm worried about that.

Green has the most bust potential and I would take any of the others before him for sure.