2020 NBA Draft

[cabs]

Pretty much agree with Randolph. Porter is a 2 who can play 3 in some scenarios but not full time, Haliburton is a 1 or 2 and Ball is the only one that could possibly defend 3's regularly if he fills out and tries harder but that remains to be seen

 

[cabs]

I think Ball could be really fun in cleveland. I can't stand his dad and never been a fan of Lonzo but lamelo's passing would be great to watch. Porter and Sexton would benefit from it especially on fast breaks, pick and rolls with Drummond should be good too. 6'8 with a 6'10 wingspan, just think he is the right player for us... but he has a lot of doubters with legit concerns about his defense/shot

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

I won't argue your last point. The Sexton and Garland picks gnaw at my Cavaliers fan soul because they were redundant and didn't provide an offensive centerpiece who runs the offense. However, is Haliburton that guy? SGA was a guy I liked in the late lottery, where Sexton was selected. Can we be sure a player like that who had an epxtra year of development should go top 5?

Let's look at his numbers with the USA U-19 team that features your boy Perry. Credit to an article by The Ringer: He was ninth on the team in scoring (7.9 points per game), but was first in 2-point percentage (85.0), 3-point percentage (55.0), minutes (24.7), assists (6.9), and assist-to-turnover ratio (6.9-to-1); second in steals (2.3); and fourth in blocks (0.7).

Those numbers are objectively outstanding and, as I've said, a lot like what Delly can do for a team when he is at Peak Delly. But if a team is trying to develop 3-4 players already on the roster at guard, can you justify yet another one if he isn't really looking like a Ball type of offensive centerpiece when a forward or center could be sitting there with just as much potential?

Minutes are indeed a numbers game when a team is trying to develop young players. If you don't recognize that, you are one foot deep into what made Sam Hinkie get removed forcibly from his gig in Philly.

I haven't watched any of these guys, but I do read what you guys write.

Halliburton is being described as a pass first PG who is a solid defender but doesn't look to score. Lamelo Ball is a poor shooter who doesn't defend.

Why is Ball so much more of a valuable offensive centerpiece? Sifting through all the comments, it seems like Lamelo's primary selling point is that he's a flashy passer.

Again, going just off what you guys say...not sure how a poor shooting/defending PG can go No. 1 overall.

 

[Nathan S]

I haven't watched any of these guys, but I do read what you guys write.

Halliburton is being described as a pass first PG who is a solid defender but doesn't look to score. Lamelo Ball is a poor shooter who doesn't defend.

Why is Ball so much more of a valuable offensive centerpiece? Sifting through all the comments, it seems like Lamelo's primary selling point is that he's a flashy passer.

Again, going just off what you guys say...not sure how a poor shooting/defending PG can go No. 1 overall.

Ball is definitely the riskier pick, but the upside is there, I think, because of his age. The fact that he's arguably the best pure passer in the draft at 18 years old says a lot. Optimistically, his shooting will improve with time and better shot selection, and he has a relatively high floor defensively thanks to his physical tools.

Agree it's crazy that a guy who shot 38% from the field and 25% from 3 is non-ironically being talked about as a #1 pick

 

[Randolphkeys]

I haven't watched any of these guys, but I do read what you guys write.

Halliburton is being described as a pass first PG who is a solid defender but doesn't look to score. Lamelo Ball is a poor shooter who doesn't defend.

Why is Ball so much more of a valuable offensive centerpiece? Sifting through all the comments, it seems like Lamelo's primary selling point is that he's a flashy passer.

Again, going just off what you guys say...not sure how a poor shooting/defending PG can go No. 1 overall.

I have Ball ranked highly against every fiber of my being. He has roughly the same frame as his big brother Lonzo, who has developed into a versatile wing creator and defender. LaMelo is going to be better than his older brother, in my opinion, because he is a better passer, better spring as an athlete, and his shooting form is less of a train wreck. The fact that he is transforming his body during Covid-19 is a positive sign in this weird pause in basketball. I believe the Australian league helped him develop past the small bubble of hoops IQ he had before.

I absolutely cannot believe I'm signing off on a child of LaVar Ball joining the Cavs, talk about a weak draft class!

 

[Nathan S]

Another fun graph (which does nothing to clarify why I have Ball #1 on my board):

 

[Sir'Dom Pointer]

Honestly, I don't know who to pick and I won't pretend that I know.

The issue we are facing is basically compounded by the fact we have a guard that we picked in the early lottery that was underwheming, who showed some glimpses but not enough,although still has potential; plus the absolute constant that Sexton and Garland can not co-exist long term and to top it all, this draft class looks to have the most superstar/all-star potential centered around the guard position. And obviously the lack of tape/data for almost the entirety of this draft class.

It's a terrible position to be in.

 

[Sir'Dom Pointer]

Bad team construction that kinda reminds me of Orlando. It's sad to say, but Garland kinda fucked it for us...and even if he works out, we will be giving up or not maximizing someone else, or the team as a whole.

 

[Sir'Dom Pointer]

James Wiseman's shot looks clean.

 

[Adam]

He also seems really short there shooting over some size

 

[MikeOC33]

James Wiseman's shot looks clean.

Ummm...ok...small sample size and all that, but that looked good for a young man with his size.
We all know BPA is always a good option, but with our roster l think BPA who isn't a guard is the better option.

 

[Randolphkeys]

James Wiseman's shot looks clean.

That is a whole lot of pretty, but the Cavs drafted the guard version of Wiseman last season. Garland killed it in drills, but in live action the rust showed up. Flip side, I know the Cavs want him. I'd be fine with Wiseman, but he makes me nervous. This year, they all make me nervous.

 

[panchan]

If I was the Cavs GM with a high draft pick I would hate this draft. There are no absolutely clear number one picks it seems to me - even ranking them is perilous and can make someone who picks lower seem like a great talent evaluator when a lot was luck. I think one of LaMello, Hayes or Haliburton is going to be a really good guard despite their various weaknesses. Wound`t be surprised if one was an all-star. But which one? And is that unclear possibility enough to give Garland or whoever less room to grow?

Wiseman or Okongwu - it might be foolish to pass up both with Tristan Thomas probably leaving - and do I really want to commit to Drummond? And yeah, I`d love to get a great prospect at Small Forward. But Deni, Okoro, Vassell and others all have holes. And is Anthony Edwards potentially the next (fill in the powerful, athletic all-star scoring, rebounding, defensive guard`s name) that we will shoot ourselves for years for having passed up on?

I admire Nathan S. to at least give a Tier ranking - that takes guts.

So just because it is more fun to get the conversation going I am going to give my far too early 1~5 ranking if I was the Cavs. I am willing to look stupid later! I challenge you to list your own. If they are on the board and it is your pick for the Cavs - in what order do you take your top five?

1. LaMelo - yep, his lack of shooting scares me to death but with a decent shot and growth in other areas he could be a player to build a team around. And no I don`t want two 6`2" guards!
2. Wiseman - I know, I know - a center. This is a big chance - but he has a shot to be a top 5 center in just a couple years and stabilize a defense for years to come. Do I want to keep Drummond at three times the money for the next 3+ years? Not really.
3. Deni Avdija - Euro players can be a swing and a miss and he scares me too. But a big, skilled player who could play more than one position, and knows how to pass! and who with a better shot (that is the biggest question) could could be a starter on a contending team for years.
4. Okongwu - yeah another big. But what holds true for Wiseman is somewhat true for Okongwu. Young and great defense? Seems to have the ability to grow in other areas and a hard worker? Hard not to like.
5. Anthony Edwards - swing for the fences. The possible outcomes are very broad it seems to me. But young, uber athletic, 6`5" guards who can impacts a game like he might don`t grow on trees.

Even typing this makes me want to change it... Hayes, Vassell, Okoro all are attractive to me. But I would love to have some of your picks. What are your top five in order for the Cavs.

 

[daddywags]

I form my opinions from just watching live games of the top college players coupled with the fine film and data analysis we find here. Not a lot of games to watch this year with the shortened season, unfortunately. Guys I like are:

Ball - Should be able to run the point from the get-go and form a nice backcourt duo with Sexton. His shooting really worries me, but his brother has made a pretty decent career without ever fixing his shooting issues.

Halliburton - Same reasoning as Ball, but higher floor and lower ceiling, without the shooting concerns.

Okongwu - I just love his game and his motor. I could see him moving right into the TT role and eventually expanding it with better goal protection, shooting and floor running.

I won't complain about Avdija or Wiseman. I do not like Edwards or Toppin.

 

[CleveRocks]

My wholly uniformed list of the top five for Cleveland.

Obi Toppin..seems to have fallen out of favor as we are not playing, but I like his game and he has a proven court record.. might be a reflection on my risk tolerance. We swing for the fences with Sexton and Garland..

Wiseman. His physical tools will succeed in the League. In a draft of uncertainty, this is a solid pick

Okongu, another solid big, arguably lower risk than Wiseman.

Vernon Carey, another big, Duke pedigree, was having a good year before they shut it down.. I think Duke would have made final four, and a good tournament would have moved him up..

Ball.. if you are going tall guard then Ok.. but not thrilled with the potential for drama.. at some level you have to question the Garland decision from last year.. I mean, I can't imagine the Cavs did not know this would be a guard draft this year, and there were small forwards last year that had better data based projections than Garland, AND we already had Sexton... Yet we picked a slick looking small point anyway.. just seems like planning was not very good..