2021 Draft Prospects Thread

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

I agree you dont pick for just need if there are better options at different positions like for example they should draft Oweh for his potential or Newsome if he is there or maybe Farley slides, but lets say Kadarius Toney slides and is available or some other option of a position of less need but has exceptional skill they take him and dont look back but obviously another team might give up value to leapfrog another team to take your pick for that guy etc and you walk away just as happy.
not all boards are the same. Jamin Davis of Kentucky didnt play with Surrat at UNC unless there is a 3rd brother and it is absolutely possible after his season and stand out pro day he is a late first early 2nd grade option even as a LB imo.
I have been hoping he would stay sleeping and they could steal him at 59 but that won't happen now. He is easily the Benji on strippers hip not the dolla

You're absolutely right. I don't know how my wires got crossed.

Did they both go to the Senior Bowl?

Either way, UNC's Surratt was touted much more highly than Jamin Davis for a while in this process... and I like Davis more than him. I'm just saying, I'm probably higher than the crowd on Jamin and I can say he shouldn't be a first-round pick.

 

[raiders91sc]

CB GREG NEWSOME II, NORTHWESTERN​

WR KADARIUS TONEY, FLORIDA​

LB JEREMIAH OWUSU-KORAMOAH, NOTRE DAME​

I am stuck on these 3 guys at 26 and maybe we move up in 2nd to get 2 of the 3.

Toney makes people miss. I like our veteran WRs and even some of the younger guys. They get open and they catch the ball but in todays game speed kills. Look at KC and TB. You throw OBJ, Landry, Toney and Njoku at defenses ur gonna cause some problem. Sorry I am a big fan of Njoku and think if this kid stays healthy he can be all pro. Kid has grown in his 4 years here. His first 2 years kid couldn't catch or block but after watching him do both last year I think he is gonna take a bigger jump this year. Plus this help us make the tough decision for 22 when Landry and OBJ contracts need to be looked at.

I think JOK is perfect for Woods defense but is he just a Harrison clone?? Harrison played good for us in his short season here. I would think Woods wants to use Harrison as his 2nd LB on 3rd downs and this lets him keep Delpit on field with Johnson at safety. On 3rd downs with Garrett Richardson Clowney McKinnley or Takitaki on the line and Walker or Phillips and Harrison at LBs and Ward Williams Hill Johnson Delpit in the back that is a lot of speed coming at you. Perfect defense vs KC and Baltimore. If they don't think Harrison can do it JOK would fit right in there.

On Newsome I think last years health report showed we need 4 CBs in the rotation. Ward is usually only good for 12 and Williams has missed 20 of his first 32 games. Kid is only 20 and has good size something we kinda lack at the position.

I would love to get Newsome and Toney with our 1st and 2nd but I wouldn't be surprised if both are gone even before we pick at 26.

 

[Randolphkeys]

I agree with this and I think there is reason to wait to take a cornerback.

Only point I want to make is that it is exceedingly rare for non-first round corners to be even average starters in their first year. I usually am pretty critical of how PFF uses stats, but I think this article is pretty fair. The success in the first round is extraordinarily high - pretty much as high as any other position and higher than most. But there is a sizable drop-off into the second and, after that, you're probably better off drafting a superb athlete and hoping you can teach them to be a good starter.

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-investigating-historical-draft-success-at-defensive-positions

If the Browns do want a starting corner this year then I would say you have to do it in the first or second. I think this draft is deep enough where a few future starters may be available going into day three.

I agree with your statement on round three. At the end of the second day, players are rarely plug-and-play ready.

I do think back to a few recent drafts where corners with all the right tools were taken later, and delivered by their second year. James Bradberry was a second rounder expected to go later, Shaquille Griffin was a third rounder, same with Carlton Davis.

Some drafts aren't as deep and the tools corner prospects go off the board earlier, but I like the tools on so many day two corners in this draft.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

CB GREG NEWSOME II, NORTHWESTERN​

WR KADARIUS TONEY, FLORIDA​

LB JEREMIAH OWUSU-KORAMOAH, NOTRE DAME​

I am stuck on these 3 guys at 26 and maybe we move up in 2nd to get 2 of the 3.

Toney makes people miss. I like our veteran WRs and even some of the younger guys. They get open and they catch the ball but in todays game speed kills. Look at KC and TB. You throw OBJ, Landry, Toney and Njoku at defenses ur gonna cause some problem. Sorry I am a big fan of Njoku and think if this kid stays healthy he can be all pro. Kid has grown in his 4 years here. His first 2 years kid couldn't catch or block but after watching him do both last year I think he is gonna take a bigger jump this year. Plus this help us make the tough decision for 22 when Landry and OBJ contracts need to be looked at.

I think JOK is perfect for Woods defense but is he just a Harrison clone?? Harrison played good for us in his short season here. I would think Woods wants to use Harrison as his 2nd LB on 3rd downs and this lets him keep Delpit on field with Johnson at safety. On 3rd downs with Garrett Richardson Clowney McKinnley or Takitaki on the line and Walker or Phillips and Harrison at LBs and Ward Williams Hill Johnson Delpit in the back that is a lot of speed coming at you. Perfect defense vs KC and Baltimore. If they don't think Harrison can do it JOK would fit right in there.

On Newsome I think last years health report showed we need 4 CBs in the rotation. Ward is usually only good for 12 and Williams has missed 20 of his first 32 games. Kid is only 20 and has good size something we kinda lack at the position.

I would love to get Newsome and Toney with our 1st and 2nd but I wouldn't be surprised if both are gone even before we pick at 26.

I don't think any of these three is on the board at 26, let alone us being able to take one at 26 and trade back up for another.

I think Toney is much closer to the two Alabama receivers on NFL boards than he is on internet mock drafts. But I also think both Moores should be close as well. After Chase, I don't think there's anyone else who stands out. I'd lump Smith, Toney, Waddle and Rondale Moore all together.

If any of them are still there at 26, I have no problem with the pick.

 

[Jordan]

I agree with your statement on round three. At the end of the second day, players are rarely plug-and-play ready.

I do think back to a few recent drafts where corners with all the right tools were taken later, and delivered by their second year. James Bradberry was a second rounder expected to go later, Shaquille Griffin was a third rounder, same with Carlton Davis.

Some drafts aren't as deep and the tools corner prospects go off the board earlier, but I like the tools on so many day two corners in this draft.

I totally agree. I do not think a corner on day one is a necessity.

 

[DJTJ]

I don't think any of these three is on the board at 26, let alone us being able to take one at 26 and trade back up for another.

I think Toney is much closer to the two Alabama receivers on NFL boards than he is on internet mock drafts. But I also think both Moores should be close as well. After Chase, I don't think there's anyone else who stands out. I'd lump Smith, Toney, Waddle and Rondale Moore all together.

If any of them are still there at 26, I have no problem with the pick.

Is Greg Newsome to Chicago the easiest pick to mock? I just can’t imagine him getting passed them.

 

[Bob_The_Cat]

I agree with this and I think there is reason to wait to take a cornerback.

Only point I want to make is that it is exceedingly rare for non-first round corners to be even average starters in their first year. I usually am pretty critical of how PFF uses stats, but I think this article is pretty fair. The success in the first round is extraordinarily high - pretty much as high as any other position and higher than most. But there is a sizable drop-off into the second and, after that, you're probably better off drafting a superb athlete and hoping you can teach them to be a good starter.

https://www.pff.com/news/draft-investigating-historical-draft-success-at-defensive-positions

If the Browns do want a starting corner this year then I would say you have to do it in the first or second. I think this draft is deep enough where a few future starters may be available going into day three.

So I understand what the chart is saying, but I’d have to imagine the chart for damn near every other position looks almost identical. It only stands to reason that the highest success rate at any position is going to come in the first two rounds.

Our need at CB isn’t so significant that you pass up a more talented player at another position. If we can’t find someone in the draft, AB’s had some success in the trade market. Could be some guys that get cut after the draft as well.

 

[Mr. Orange]

BPA on offense or defense in Round 1. You just need to keep hitting on first rounders. If it works out where BPA is your biggest area of need like it did with Jed, then you’ve really got a nice pick. Ravens and Steelers have for years just taken then BPA that falls to them. We are in that position now. WR, DL, DB, LB, OL whatever. We can use help or depth across the board but no need to reach at 26. Get a solid starter for the next five years on a rookie deal. Sometimes they become pro bowlers. That’s how you build a sustainable winner. AB is really doing a great job.

 

[Jordan]

So I understand what the chart is saying, but I’d have to imagine the chart for damn near every other position looks almost identical. It only stands to reason that the highest success rate at any position is going to come in the first two rounds.

Our need at CB isn’t so significant that you pass up a more talented player at another position. If we can’t find someone in the draft, AB’s had some success in the trade market. Could be some guys that get cut after the draft as well.

It looks similar, but it’s substantially more extreme for corner. Teams tend to be good at evaluating corner - better than any other position. This means there is less variance in outcomes between rounds. The article explains this if you keep on reading.

 

[Jack Brickman]

I don't think any of these three is on the board at 26, let alone us being able to take one at 26 and trade back up for another.

I think Toney is much closer to the two Alabama receivers on NFL boards than he is on internet mock drafts. But I also think both Moores should be close as well. After Chase, I don't think there's anyone else who stands out. I'd lump Smith, Toney, Waddle and Rondale Moore all together.

If any of them are still there at 26, I have no problem with the pick.

I think Marshall and Bateman are as good or better as prospects than all those guys you listed outside of Chase.

 

[Smooth]

I’m just confused why WR is even discussion for an early pick?

I understand OBJ and Landry have outs in their contracts next year, but that doesn’t necessitate taking a WR based on that..

The Browns have Higgins and DPJ to protect against any loss they may face with either, and Hodge also proved to step up when needed... Not to mention, the Browns Stefanski uses multiple receiver sets at a lower level than most...

If you say the Browns make take a shot on a deep threat after round 3, I could see that, but otherwise I don’t think WR is even in discussion for any high pick... To me, it’ll be DL and DBs early...

 

[The Hill]

I’m just confused why WR is even discussion for an early pick?

I understand OBJ and Landry have outs in their contracts next year, but that doesn’t necessitate taking a WR based on that..

The Browns have Higgins and DPJ to protect against any loss they may face with either, and Hodge also proved to step up when needed... Not to mention, the Browns Stefanski uses multiple receiver sets at a lower level than most...

If you say the Browns make take a shot on a deep threat after round 3, I could see that, but otherwise I don’t think WR is even in discussion for any high pick... To me, it’ll be DL and DBs early...

While I agree they will likely prioritize DL or DB early, I could definitely see the reasoning behind drafting a WR early if a guy they like is available. Higgins and Peoples-Jones are nice guys to have as depth, but I wouldn’t want either one as a starter. It makes sense to add the replacement for OBJ or Landry this year so they can learn the system and hit the ground running next year.

I guess it all comes down to whether you believe Higgins and/or Peoples-Jones are starter-worthy, and whether we will retain both Landry and OBJ beyond 2021. I believe the answer to both questions is no. So it makes sense to start bringing in replacements now.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

I’m just confused why WR is even discussion for an early pick?

I understand OBJ and Landry have outs in their contracts next year, but that doesn’t necessitate taking a WR based on that..

The Browns have Higgins and DPJ to protect against any loss they may face with either, and Hodge also proved to step up when needed... Not to mention, the Browns Stefanski uses multiple receiver sets at a lower level than most...

If you say the Browns make take a shot on a deep threat after round 3, I could see that, but otherwise I don’t think WR is even in discussion for any high pick... To me, it’ll be DL and DBs early...

According to a lot of people, it's a premium position. I've never viewed it that way, but I'm starting to come around to it.

This is one of the best, and deepest, receiver classes. Between last year and this year, it's insane how much receiver talent is coming into the league.

OBJ and Landry are expensive. If you can replace an old, expensive asset with a young, cheap one, that's how you keep the position group strong for a long time.

I wouldn't take a receiver at 26, but I'm not going to hate the move if we do.

 

[ChicagoCavFan]

I have believed that WR is a priority early, mostly because I have no faith in OBJ even being to close to what he once was. Relying on him to be WR1 is a risky play, considering what we saw on the field already in addition to the injuries and age.

 

[Jack Brickman]

I’m just confused why WR is even discussion for an early pick?

I understand OBJ and Landry have outs in their contracts next year, but that doesn’t necessitate taking a WR based on that..

The Browns have Higgins and DPJ to protect against any loss they may face with either, and Hodge also proved to step up when needed... Not to mention, the Browns Stefanski uses multiple receiver sets at a lower level than most...

If you say the Browns make take a shot on a deep threat after round 3, I could see that, but otherwise I don’t think WR is even in discussion for any high pick... To me, it’ll be DL and DBs early...

Because we will presumably part ways with one of Landry or Beckham next spring and it would be nice to have a quality prospect who has a year learning the system at their backs to step in as a starter.