2022 Cleveland Guardians Regular Season Thread

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CDAV45

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I've been thinking about this. What does "just as he has all season" really mean? Identical numbers or...
Lower BABIP
Less power because of stadium dimensions/baseballs/better pitching
Less walks because pitchers throw him more strikes
More strikeouts because pitchers are better

Fangraphs projections have him at .261/.318/.361 which really just factors all this in. The good thing is that it's still a 95 wRC+ which if he is able to defensively handle his position will put him in good position to provide some solid value for his ball club as a starter in the bottom part of the order.

This is a team that was throwing out Mercado and Zimmer a year ago and don't get me started on Miller, so hell I'll take that triple slash.
Identical numbers is a .300 hitter with an excellent eye and few strikeouts. He's got power that doesn't show itself as often as it could if he sold out for it. He's a hitter and a damn good one. Take last night. He had another hit, but it was the scorcher to the LFer that impressed me. I think the kid is going to continue to be a fantastic hitter, but you don't have to share that thought. However, you have no evidence to suggest that he won't be so build the best case you can if you desire.
 

Mott the Hoople

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At the start of the season everybody, including me, said, this roster stinks. No way they make the playoffs.
Now I'm hearing, OK, they'll make the postseason, but they will get smoked in the playoffs.

Not so fast,,,,
Let's compare the 2022 G's with the 2016 AL Champs.
Not their whole career. But compare the player in the fall of 2016 to the players in the fall of 2022.

LF Brandon Guyer < Steven Kwan
CF Rajai Davis = Myles Straw (being generous to Rajai)
RF Lonnie Chisenhall < Oscar Gonzales
3B Jose Ramirez = Jose Ramirez's
SS Frankie Lindor > Amed Rosario
2B Jason Kipnis < Andres Gimenez
1B Mike Napoli < Josh Naylor
C Gomes/Perez = Hedges/ Maile
DH Carlos Santana > Owen Miller/Brennan

Pitching I see as a wash. Both had strong bullpens.

Do you think I'm being fair? I think the 22 G's would smoke the 16 Tribe.
 

Alabuckeye

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Pitching may not be a wash. We were working with duct tape, wire and Talbot in those games in ‘16. and Cody Allen….Emmanuel Clase……wow.
 

Out of the Rafters at the Q

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At the start of the season everybody, including me, said, this roster stinks. No way they make the playoffs.
Now I'm hearing, OK, they'll make the postseason, but they will get smoked in the playoffs.

Not so fast,,,,
Let's compare the 2022 G's with the 2016 AL Champs.
Not their whole career. But compare the player in the fall of 2016 to the players in the fall of 2022.

LF Brandon Guyer < Steven Kwan
CF Rajai Davis = Myles Straw (being generous to Rajai)
RF Lonnie Chisenhall < Oscar Gonzales
3B Jose Ramirez = Jose Ramirez's
SS Frankie Lindor > Amed Rosario
2B Jason Kipnis < Andres Gimenez
1B Mike Napoli < Josh Naylor
C Gomes/Perez = Hedges/ Maile
DH Carlos Santana > Owen Miller/Brennan

Pitching I see as a wash. Both had strong bullpens.

Do you think I'm being fair? I think the 22 G's would smoke the 16 Tribe.
I don't think you're being fair.

Gomes/Perez were significantly better than Hedges/Maile.

Pitching is absolutely nowhere near a wash.

But, baseball is the ultimate "Get in and you have a shot" sport. So, we're getting in. We have a shot.
 

DerekG123

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At the start of the season everybody, including me, said, this roster stinks. No way they make the playoffs.
Now I'm hearing, OK, they'll make the postseason, but they will get smoked in the playoffs.

Not so fast,,,,
Let's compare the 2022 G's with the 2016 AL Champs.
Not their whole career. But compare the player in the fall of 2016 to the players in the fall of 2022.

LF Brandon Guyer < Steven Kwan
CF Rajai Davis = Myles Straw (being generous to Rajai)
RF Lonnie Chisenhall < Oscar Gonzales
3B Jose Ramirez = Jose Ramirez's
SS Frankie Lindor > Amed Rosario
2B Jason Kipnis < Andres Gimenez
1B Mike Napoli < Josh Naylor
C Gomes/Perez = Hedges/ Maile
DH Carlos Santana > Owen Miller/Brennan

Pitching I see as a wash. Both had strong bullpens.

Do you think I'm being fair? I think the 22 G's would smoke the 16 Tribe.
The Andrew Miller factor was the difference maker.
 

Soar

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2016 was honestly insane chemistry and grit combined with insane performances from Kluber and Miller.

Bauer and his drone shit, Carrasco having a broken hand.

Wasn’t some random kid named Ryan Merritt the pitcher who pitched out of his mind vs Toronto ?

It was just a fascinating run that year.
 

CBBI

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Gomes/Perez were significantly better than Hedges/Maile.

For their careers Gomes and Perez absolutely were better, but I think you're forgetting how badly Gomes and Perez (and Gimenez) absolutely sucked the year the Indians went the World Series.

Gomes 34 OPS+ in 264 plate appearances, -1.0 oWar, 0.7 dWar
Perez 52 OPS+ in 184 plate appearances, 0.0 oWar, 1.0 dWar
Gimenez 57 OPS+ in 155 plate appearances, -0.2 oWar, 0.0 dWar
-1.2 combined oWar, 1.7 combined dWar

Hedges 48 OPS+ in 316 plate appearances, -0.6 oWar, 1.2 dWar
Maile 82 OPS+ in 188 plate appearances, 0.6 oWar, 0.4 dWar
0.0 combined oWar, 1.6 combined dWar

About as close to a wash as you can get. I give Perez credit for hitting 3 home runs in the playoffs that year, but overall he was 8 for 43 in 15 playoff games.
 

Alabuckeye

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Yeah Merritt got a key win for us…not Talbot.
tomlin had a nice postseason till the WS start.
Kluber also
 

ZinAZ

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For their careers Gomes and Perez absolutely were better, but I think you're forgetting how badly Gomes and Perez (and Gimenez) absolutely sucked the year the Indians went the World Series.

Gomes 34 OPS+ in 264 plate appearances, -1.0 oWar, 0.7 dWar
Perez 52 OPS+ in 184 plate appearances, 0.0 oWar, 1.0 dWar
Gimenez 57 OPS+ in 155 plate appearances, -0.2 oWar, 0.0 dWar
-1.2 combined oWar, 1.7 combined dWar

Hedges 48 OPS+ in 316 plate appearances, -0.6 oWar, 1.2 dWar
Maile 82 OPS+ in 188 plate appearances, 0.6 oWar, 0.4 dWar
0.0 combined oWar, 1.6 combined dWar

About as close to a wash as you can get. I give Perez credit for hitting 3 home runs in the playoffs that year, but overall he was 8 for 43 in 15 playoff games.
I think people forget forget how good Nap was
At the start of the season everybody, including me, said, this roster stinks. No way they make the playoffs.
Now I'm hearing, OK, they'll make the postseason, but they will get smoked in the playoffs.

Not so fast,,,,
Let's compare the 2022 G's with the 2016 AL Champs.
Not their whole career. But compare the player in the fall of 2016 to the players in the fall of 2022.

LF Brandon Guyer < Steven Kwan
CF Rajai Davis = Myles Straw (being generous to Rajai)
RF Lonnie Chisenhall < Oscar Gonzales
3B Jose Ramirez = Jose Ramirez's
SS Frankie Lindor > Amed Rosario
2B Jason Kipnis < Andres Gimenez
1B Mike Napoli < Josh Naylor
C Gomes/Perez = Hedges/ Maile
DH Carlos Santana > Owen Miller/Brennan

Pitching I see as a wash. Both had strong bullpens.

Do you think I'm being fair? I think the 22 G's would smoke the 16 Tribe.
Well Nap had 34HR and 101 RBI I would put that > Naylor, the 2022 Jose is outplaying the 2016 Jose. The big swing is at DH where Santana was way better than what we are getting out of that spot now.
 

bigfoot5415

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2016 was honestly insane chemistry and grit combined with insane performances from Kluber and Miller.

Bauer and his drone shit, Carrasco having a broken hand.

Wasn’t some random kid named Ryan Merritt the pitcher who pitched out of his mind vs Toronto ?

It was just a fascinating run that year.
And no Brantley or Salazar
 

Real Deal

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At the start of the season everybody, including me, said, this roster stinks. No way they make the playoffs.
Now I'm hearing, OK, they'll make the postseason, but they will get smoked in the playoffs.

Not so fast,,,,
Let's compare the 2022 G's with the 2016 AL Champs.
Not their whole career. But compare the player in the fall of 2016 to the players in the fall of 2022.

LF Brandon Guyer < Steven Kwan
CF Rajai Davis = Myles Straw (being generous to Rajai)
RF Lonnie Chisenhall < Oscar Gonzales
3B Jose Ramirez = Jose Ramirez's
SS Frankie Lindor > Amed Rosario
2B Jason Kipnis < Andres Gimenez
1B Mike Napoli < Josh Naylor
C Gomes/Perez = Hedges/ Maile
DH Carlos Santana > Owen Miller/Brennan

Pitching I see as a wash. Both had strong bullpens.

Do you think I'm being fair? I think the 22 G's would smoke the 16 Tribe.
Some undervalue on the lethal weapon of Andrew Miller that'll shut the door on any kind of momentum 5th-9th innings, Gomes/Perez from an offensive standpoint, and the SP is slightly better because they proved it.

I know we have a Wild Card to go first and that's the perfect warm-up, I'm just scared of a 5 game series, always been, I hate them to be honest. I think this team NOW has a shot against anybody in a 7 game series at this point in time. 5 games can be flukey.
 

Mott the Hoople

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Thanks for everybody's replies. Interesting conversation.

- I forgot Titio would use Miller anywhere in the playoffs. Not just as a closer. I wonder if Karinchak's performance lately will allow Tito to use Clase in a similar way?
- No question Napoli had a impactful 16 season. But by the fall of 16 I think Nap was running on fumes. I still give the edge now to Naylor. Both were inspirational to the team.
- In the Wild Card Round our 3 SP were Bauer, Kluber, and Tomlin. Overall I like Bieber, McKenzie, and Quantrill. But close.
 

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