2022 Cleveland Guardians Regular Season Thread

[sportscoach]

So long Jet

I didn't think he would finish the season on the roster. Does this mean Brennan is getting a promotion?

 

[petes999]

I didn't think he would finish the season on the roster. Does this mean Brennan is getting a promotion?

I doubt it ... they still have Call, Oscar, Brooks, Palacios, Alford, Benson and maybe Jones inserted somewhere

 

[Criznit]

So long Jet

I wonder if he'll be on the next Daniel out of town..

....Warning has been issued Criznit..

 

[CDAV45]

I'll be sincere and honest, can you quit with this narrative of we didn't want to spend on significant upgrade because that is completely and utterly bull shit so please shut it about it!

We all wanted some type of upgrade, but we wanted it within reason. So if you want to trade Espino in a package for Reynolds or Laureano then you could go for, but you are the only one... it doesn't mean we don't want that player, but we aren't willing to trade our top 5 prospects for one player... Is that wrong to keep our top 5 over acquiring one player?

Since the FO couldn't find a reasonable upgrade via trade within reason, they decided to run with the rookies. Haven't you been reading the GM thread, me, @CDAV45 @Gson have all been putting up weekly trade ideas to upgrade this team. No one here wants to stay put, but at the same time, we aren't willing to give up everything for one player!

Uhhhhhh I don't think I've been posting "weekly trade ideas to upgrade this team". In fact, I've stated that they probably see most if not all of the answers in house. Now I have stated that we sure as hell could use a guy like Yepez, but outside of that I don't see much in the way of trades that will bring in an MLB player. I don't even know what it would take to get Yepez because he is severely underrated on the BTV site which isn't a good tool anyway. It's fun, but it isn't worth a damn when it comes to certain players' values.

 

[sportscoach]

Uhhhhhh I don't think I've been posting "weekly trade ideas to upgrade this team". In fact, I've stated that they probably see most if not all of the answers in house. Now I have stated that we sure as hell could use a guy like Yepez, but outside of that I don't see much in the way of trades that will bring in an MLB player. I don't even know what it would take to get Yepez because he is severely underrated on the BTV site which isn't a good tool anyway. It's fun, but it isn't worth a damn when it comes to certain players' values.

Well I have been posting and tagging you and GSon and we have been talking have we not? Haha

I was literally trying to point out, we don't wanna sit on our butts and we wanna do something. It's just hard to see a ton that's within reason or realistic at the moment.

 

[CDAV45]

Well I have been posting and tagging you and GSon and we have been talking have we not? Haha

I was literally trying to point out, we don't wanna sit on our butts and we wanna do something. It's just hard to see a ton that's within reason or realistic at the moment.

Fair enough and I'm not interested in sitting around either when it comes to replacing guys that we know need replaced.

 

[CDAV45]

I wonder why Pilkington was called up for the start tomorrow instead of giving it to Morgan? Maybe they're piggybacking?

I also wonder why they think Civale's "glute cramp" is severe enough to put him on the 15 day IL? Something seems amiss here.

 

[MadThinker88]

I wonder why Pilkington was called up for the start tomorrow instead of giving it to Morgan? Maybe they're piggybacking?

I also wonder why they think Civale's "glute cramp" is severe enough to put him on the 15 day IL? Something seems amiss here.

Dont forget Eli Morgan did get some game action on Tuesday night...
They might not feel he can give enough length to go beyond a couple of innings on Thursday..

 

[sportscoach]

Morgan actually hasn't been stretched out to start. He's stretched out to 40ish pitches at the moment plus he has been good out of the pen it feels like. Since they lack bullpen guys, they are kind of keeping him in there for now.

 

[Benway]

I also wonder why they think Civale's "glute cramp" is severe enough to put him on the 15 day IL? Something seems amiss here.

Tito discussed that very issue pregame on radio; it's totally precautionary. He said 15 was really longer than they wanted but there's no choice with starting pitchers, and that Civale may even be fine to make his next turn, but they want to be extra careful.

Which is exactly what I would say if I was trying to hide a major injury!

 

[CATS44]

I'll be sincere and honest, can you quit with this narrative of we didn't want to spend on significant upgrade because that is completely and utterly bull shit so please shut it about it!

We all wanted some type of upgrade, but we wanted it within reason. So if you want to trade Espino in a package for Reynolds or Laureano then you could go for, but you are the only one... it doesn't mean we don't want that player, but we aren't willing to trade our top 5 prospects for one player... Is that wrong to keep our top 5 over acquiring one player?

Since the FO couldn't find a reasonable upgrade via trade within reason, they decided to run with the rookies. Haven't you been reading the GM thread, me, @CDAV45 @Gson have all been putting up weekly trade ideas to upgrade this team. No one here wants to stay put, but at the same time, we aren't willing to give up everything for one player!

Sorry, Coach, but it is true.

Heck, there was a general concensus on this board that the FO shouldn't trade Palacios for Ian Happ. Really,

Arias was generally untouchable on this forum, because he was guaranteed to be our starting SS at some point this year..much much better than Gimenez.

And almost nobody was interested in guys like Taylor Ward, because he wasn't a real upgrade.

Happ wasn't an upgrade. McNeil wasn't an upgrade.

Almost all the trade proposals suggest trading for MORE prospects, not for proven MLB production. And a high percentage of them are aimed to fix a problem we don't really have...catcher. Everybody seemingly wants a catcher who hits, which isn't the need on this team.

So many insist that we can't contend without a catcher that hits better than ours. Its BS.

Case in point: The first place team in the AL East, the Yankees. Their catchers are WORSE than ours at the plate, but they have the best record in the AL.

Case in point, part two: The first place team in the AL West, the Astros. Their catchers are WORSE than ours at the plate, but they have the second best record in the AL.

Case in point, part three: The first place team in the NL East, the Mets. Their catchers are WORSE than ours at the plate, but they have the fourth best record in the NL.

Nobody wanted to trade our top five prospects for one major upgrade, but I was certainly willing to trade four of our top ten, esp considering that we have an unmanageable number of shortstops in this org. Getting all of them to Cleveland is akin to herding cats. It can't be done.

Meanwhile, the value of several of our 'top' prospects goes down, either thru injuries or lack of production...or both. (Which is normal and should have been expected.)

I wonder what we could have gotten for a package of Jones, Arias, Freeman, and Morris last year. Thats not hindsight. I've been advocating the trading of prospects since the offseason last year, when it was obvious that we had a multiple year 40 man crunch coming...and we have more MIFs, SPS, and LH corner bats than we can ever fit onto the active roster.

What this team needs more than anything else...the number one priority...is a RH corner OF with a little pop. We don't need a HOFer, just a competent bat with some defensive ability.

Our BA vs lefties is .210.

********

This forum is full of complaints...a lot of them pointed at our youngsters. Kwan can't do this. Palacios can't do that. Miller can't do this. Straw can't do that. Clement is garbage.

We complain when we lose.

What did anybody expect with the youngest team in MLB, a high percentage of which has little or no experience against real live MLB pitchers?

These kids ain't in Columbus anymore, Toto.

A majority of this board were totally focused on 2023, 2024, and beyond. Many were more than willing to throw this year away....

Until the games began to count.

********

Nevertheless, this team as constituted can contend this year, but some things have to happen.

The rotation must round into form, which is happening. Franmil must begin producing at his normal and expected level. The squad must stay healthy. The kids with the bat to ball skills have to adjust to the adjustments that the pitchers have made to them.

And if they do stay in contention thru July, the FO has to loosen its death grip on the prospects and make a trade.

 

[33Y0]

Sorry, Coach, but it is true.

Heck, there was a general concensus on this board that the FO shouldn't trade Palacios for Ian Happ. Really,

Arias was generally untouchable on this forum, because he was guaranteed to be our starting SS at some point this year..much much better than Gimenez.

And almost nobody was interested in guys like Taylor Ward, because he wasn't a real upgrade.

Happ wasn't an upgrade. McNeil wasn't an upgrade.

Almost all the trade proposals suggest trading for MORE prospects, not for proven MLB production. And a high percentage of them are aimed to fix a problem we don't really have...catcher. Everybody seemingly wants a catcher who hits, which isn't the need on this team.

So many insist that we can't contend without a catcher that hits better than ours. Its BS.

Case in point: The first place team in the AL East, the Yankees. Their catchers are WORSE than ours at the plate, but they have the best record in the AL.

Case in point, part two: The first place team in the AL West, the Astros. Their catchers are WORSE than ours at the plate, but they have the second best record in the AL.

Case in point, part three: The first place team in the NL East, the Mets. Their catchers are WORSE than ours at the plate, but they have the fourth best record in the NL.

Nobody wanted to trade our top five prospects for one major upgrade, but I was certainly willing to trade four of our top ten, esp considering that we have an unmanageable number of shortstops in this org. Getting all of them to Cleveland is akin to herding cats. It can't be done.

Meanwhile, the value of several of our 'top' prospects goes down, either thru injuries or lack of production...or both. (Which is normal and should have been expected.)

I wonder what we could have gotten for a package of Jones, Arias, Freeman, and Morris last year. Thats not hindsight. I've been advocating the trading of prospects since the offseason last year, when it was obvious that we had a multiple year 40 man crunch coming...and we have more MIFs, SPS, and LH corner bats than we can ever fit onto the active roster.

What this team needs more than anything else...the number one priority...is a RH corner OF with a little pop. We don't need a HOFer, just a competent bat with some defensive ability.

Our BA vs lefties is .210.

********

This forum is full of complaints...a lot of them pointed at our youngsters. Kwan can't do this. Palacios can't do that. Miller can't do this. Straw can't do that. Clement is garbage.

We complain when we lose.

What did anybody expect with the youngest team in MLB, a high percentage of which has little or no experience against real live MLB pitchers?

These kids ain't in Columbus anymore, Toto.

A majority of this board were totally focused on 2023, 2024, and beyond. Many were more than willing to throw this year away....

Until the games began to count.

********

Nevertheless, this team as constituted can contend this year, but some things have to happen.

The rotation must round into form, which is happening. Franmil must begin producing at his normal and expected level. The squad must stay healthy. The kids with the bat to ball skills have to adjust to the adjustments that the pitchers have made to them.

And if they do stay in contention thru July, the FO has to loosen its death grip on the prospects and make a trade.

Lol this team as constituted can contend this year? Man, it's too early to be drunk enough to believe that...

 

[KluberSociety]

"A trade" isn't going to make this team competitive. The amount needed to give up to make the 2022 Guardians good wasn't worth it before the season, and still isn't now. As we see the team struggle, consider how much better of a situation we'd be in if we had Ian Happ and one extra win at best (he has had a career start to this year). We'd still be a fringe playoff team. Imagine if we instead traded for @CATS44 's favorite guy, Ramon Laureano.

It really takes magical thinking to believe that somehow it's the lack of offseason action that is primarily responsible for the team's poor performance and not the lack of a present core to really build on for this season.

Let the kids play. There is no panacea for this current team. Trade prospects once there is a core to build playoff runs off of.

It's amazing watching people complain about poor performance while in the same breath trying to rationalize away how the time is now to make big moves.

 

[Obscured By Clouds]

"A trade" isn't going to make this team competitive. The amount needed to give up to make the 2022 Guardians good wasn't worth it before the season, and still isn't now. As we see the team struggle, consider how much better of a situation we'd be in if we had Ian Happ and one extra win at best (he has had a career start to this year). We'd still be a fringe playoff team. Imagine if we instead traded for @CATS44 's favorite guy, Ramon Laureano.

It really takes magical thinking to believe that somehow it's the lack of offseason action that is primarily responsible for the team's poor performance and not the lack of a present core to really build on for this season.

Let the kids play. There is no panacea for this current team. Trade prospects once there is a core to build playoff runs off of.

It's amazing watching people complain about poor performance while in the same breath trying to rationalize away how the time is now to make big moves.

Sentence of the year.

 

[sportscoach]

Tito discussed that very issue pregame on radio; it's totally precautionary. He said 15 was really longer than they wanted but there's no choice with starting pitchers, and that Civale may even be fine to make his next turn, but they want to be extra careful.

Which is exactly what I would say if I was trying to hide a major injury!

Actually I disagree... I do it all the time in OOTP, where I have a weekish injury, I'll put them on the IL so I know it fully heals. I do that in a sense, this is a marathon not a sprint and I'd rather have a 100% healthy Civale for the stretch run. Remember three teams can get a wild card spot.

MLB expanded playoffs, explained: How many teams will reach 2022 postseason, other essential information

The MLB postseason is going to have a different format from recent years.

www.google.com

I bet you the organization will try for one of those spots, without giving up to much of the future of the organization of course. They want the SPs healthy and ready for a September run...

Sorry, Coach, but it is true.

Heck, there was a general concensus on this board that the FO shouldn't trade Palacios for Ian Happ. Really,

Arias was generally untouchable on this forum, because he was guaranteed to be our starting SS at some point this year..much much better than Gimenez.

And almost nobody was interested in guys like Taylor Ward, because he wasn't a real upgrade.

Happ wasn't an upgrade. McNeil wasn't an upgrade.

Almost all the trade proposals suggest trading for MORE prospects, not for proven MLB production. And a high percentage of them are aimed to fix a problem we don't really have...catcher. Everybody seemingly wants a catcher who hits, which isn't the need on this team.

So many insist that we can't contend without a catcher that hits better than ours. Its BS.

Case in point: The first place team in the AL East, the Yankees. Their catchers are WORSE than ours at the plate, but they have the best record in the AL.

Case in point, part two: The first place team in the AL West, the Astros. Their catchers are WORSE than ours at the plate, but they have the second best record in the AL.

Case in point, part three: The first place team in the NL East, the Mets. Their catchers are WORSE than ours at the plate, but they have the fourth best record in the NL.

Nobody wanted to trade our top five prospects for one major upgrade, but I was certainly willing to trade four of our top ten, esp considering that we have an unmanageable number of shortstops in this org. Getting all of them to Cleveland is akin to herding cats. It can't be done.

Meanwhile, the value of several of our 'top' prospects goes down, either thru injuries or lack of production...or both. (Which is normal and should have been expected.)

I wonder what we could have gotten for a package of Jones, Arias, Freeman, and Morris last year. Thats not hindsight. I've been advocating the trading of prospects since the offseason last year, when it was obvious that we had a multiple year 40 man crunch coming...and we have more MIFs, SPS, and LH corner bats than we can ever fit onto the active roster.

What this team needs more than anything else...the number one priority...is a RH corner OF with a little pop. We don't need a HOFer, just a competent bat with some defensive ability.

Our BA vs lefties is .210.

********

This forum is full of complaints...a lot of them pointed at our youngsters. Kwan can't do this. Palacios can't do that. Miller can't do this. Straw can't do that. Clement is garbage.

We complain when we lose.

What did anybody expect with the youngest team in MLB, a high percentage of which has little or no experience against real live MLB pitchers?

These kids ain't in Columbus anymore, Toto.

A majority of this board were totally focused on 2023, 2024, and beyond. Many were more than willing to throw this year away....

Until the games began to count.

********

Nevertheless, this team as constituted can contend this year, but some things have to happen.

The rotation must round into form, which is happening. Franmil must begin producing at his normal and expected level. The squad must stay healthy. The kids with the bat to ball skills have to adjust to the adjustments that the pitchers have made to them.

And if they do stay in contention thru July, the FO has to loosen its death grip on the prospects and make a trade.

We all wanted to make some moves, but the FO and majority on here, only want players who have team control that have a proven track record of greater than 2 WAR a season. Also we aren't willing to give up certain prospects. To get a Laureano or Reynolds we have to say goodbye to Espino plus more prospects which is a hell no. We had deals in place for Winkler and Olson but they feel apart because we didn't take Suarez nor could we offer as much as Atlanta since we couldn't extend Olson.

You come off as we don't wanna make trades and we don't want to make moves and that's dead wrong, but at the same time, we always staying within reason. We felt we could get similar WAR between Palacios and Happ then why trade Palacios plus some for Happ? That's what the problem is here. Teams aren't willing to give up the players we want within reason, so we are going to go with who we have.

"A trade" isn't going to make this team competitive. The amount needed to give up to make the 2022 Guardians good wasn't worth it before the season, and still isn't now. As we see the team struggle, consider how much better of a situation we'd be in if we had Ian Happ and one extra win at best (he has had a career start to this year). We'd still be a fringe playoff team. Imagine if we instead traded for @CATS44 's favorite guy, Ramon Laureano.

It really takes magical thinking to believe that somehow it's the lack of offseason action that is primarily responsible for the team's poor performance and not the lack of a present core to really build on for this season.

Let the kids play. There is no panacea for this current team. Trade prospects once there is a core to build playoff runs off of.

It's amazing watching people complain about poor performance while in the same breath trying to rationalize away how the time is now to make big moves.

All trades I am looking at doing would have short term and long term in mind...

We want another bat, but we aren't willing to completely do an overpay either. I am not trading my top 5 prospects to get Reynolds, but if I could trade a Freeman for someone like Ty France, then yeah I am doing it. I want a proven MLB guy, that can become part of the nucleus not a rental.

I would consider getting a Yadiel Hernandez as a rental in a sense, but he has team control even though he is older. I want long term as well (hence why I always try to get lotto prospects back in deals).

We lack bullpen depth and proven MLB hitters and I don't think that's something we can 100% overcome this season, but that being stated, there is now 3 Wild Card spots. I don't think it's wrong to go for one as long as we don't hurt our long term potential. How do we find the right mix?

If the prices comes down for a Reynolds, Laureano etc, then you know a deal will be made, but until a deal comes available that makes sense, we have to stick with our guns and develop who we have in house. Let's see what these guys can do and if we are close to a wild card spot and a Ty France, Reynolds, Mullins etc become available at a reasonable price then make the deal, if not, let's see if they can overcome the fire and become legit big leaguers.