2022 Minor League Thread

[CDAV45]

There's nothing wrong with taking a gamble on a highly talented kid, but no system should be packed with them. It's a big gamble with big risk and a big payoff if he develops. Is Benson a kid that will carry a lower average with a good OBP and power? It looks like that is certainly a possibility and we should give some value for his excellent defense too shouldn't we? Or does that only apply to the slap hitters or guys like Hedges who can't hit at all? The double standards are running rampant around here.

What they changed in their drafting strategy was taking athletic MIFers with a good hit tool with the hopes that they develop into more Lindor's and JRam's. What's the chances of that happening? So they're not going to stop taking a chance on an underdeveloped, high upside kid but it probably won't be that early in the draft going forward. A cookie cutter approach doesn't work in drafts because each one has different qualities.

 

[Tondo]

We've had this exact same conversation for years....nobody likes to hear that one of our power prospects can't make consistent contact...even though we've had highly thought of failed prospect after failed prospect, because they can't make contact.

My goodness, our high draft pick list is strewn with the smoking debris of power batters who could not hit.

You want context?

Name one decent power hitter in the last 30 years we've had that K'd 25% of the time, or more, in the minors.

Don't name...

Belle...23%
Thome...17%
Grady...15%
Pronk...21%
Franmil...21%
Victor...11%
Carlos....15%
Manny....20%
JRam....8%
Lindor....14%

But we keep waiting for the train to arrive for guys like Zimmer, Bradley, Brennan, and Jones....while making excuses for them all and citing small sample sizes of supposed progress.

We do love our huge left hand batters that can't hit a baseball and who melt like the Wicked Witch of the West whenever they face a lefty.

The reason this org has not been able to develop outfielders is simple. It has drafted batters that couldn't hit a baseball, but looked like a power forward or outside linebacker.

That changed about six years ago. Now we have a very young lineup of kids who can hit a baseball.

Fans complain that these kids can't do this and can't do that, but they are ranked eighth in the AL in fWAR with lots of upside. That may not sound like much, but the previous three years they were ranked 11th, 15th (last), and 10th.

Cats, which part of "Will Benson now makes much more consistent contact", didn't you get?

 

[CDAV45]

Cats, which part of "Will Benson now makes much more consistent contact", didn't you get?

Can we talk about the quality of contact too Tondo? You're never going to get an old fogey who loves the "old" style of baseball and is ever wishing it would return to consider upside in a player like Benson.

Most of us here understand Will's potential. Does that mean he's a sure thing? Not by any stretch of the imagination, in fact most of us feel he is a longshot, but the possibilities are very intriguing and can make a world of difference to how good an MLB is should he reach his potential.

I get what your saying about Benson and he has shown marked improvement is some important areas. Hopefully it works for him.

 

[Tondo]

I'd all but given up on Benson, but he deserves credit for what he's doing this year. He turns 24 this week, he's younger than O. Gonzalez

 

[sportscoach]

There's nothing wrong with taking a gamble on a highly talented kid, but no system should be packed with them. It's a big gamble with big risk and a big payoff if he develops. Is Benson a kid that will carry a lower average with a good OBP and power? It looks like that is certainly a possibility and we should give some value for his excellent defense too shouldn't we? Or does that only apply to the slap hitters or guys like Hedges who can't hit at all? The double standards are running rampant around here.

What they changed in their drafting strategy was taking athletic MIFers with a good hit tool with the hopes that they develop into more Lindor's and JRam's. What's the chances of that happening? So they're not going to stop taking a chance on an underdeveloped, high upside kid but it probably won't be that early in the draft going forward. A cookie cutter approach doesn't work in drafts because each one has different qualities.

They went from high upside athletes who they hope figured how to hit to let's get the guys who know how to hit, then add power to their game later and it's paying off.

Honestly I have noticed, most of the players they have been acquiring/trying to acquire have a few things in common, one, position players via mlb.com scouting have them all 50 or higher rated contact and pitching is all 50 or higher control. It doesn't mean it always translates, but honestly I feel like those guys are safer bets to get to the bigs...

No team is ever going to stop taking the Benson types of the world, but we also aren't planning on taking them early. You need to in every draft take the high upside honestly, but it's more 80-20/70-30 with the 70-80% being the type I mentioned earlier and the 20-30 as the Benson types, they were closer to 50-50 if not higher for a fair amount of years there...

 

[petes999]

 

[macbdog]

1. Is Gavin Williams the reincarnation of Bob Feller? The Flamethrower from Fayetteville?

2. As a college pitcher and going to turn 23 in a month, what good reason would the team have to not be aggressive with promoting him, if he shows that AA isn't a challenge? They didn't do that shit with Bieber.

 

[Criznit]

1. Is Gavin Williams the reincarnation of Bob Feller? The Flamethrower from Fayetteville?

2. As a college pitcher and going to turn 23 in a month, what good reason would the team have to not be aggressive with promoting him, if he shows that AA isn't a challenge? They didn't do that shit with Bieber.

Exactly.

Both Williams and Espino may find them on the very short list soon. Either one may even make it all the way to the show this season.

If there was ever a silver lining for an injury... Maybe Espino makes up some innings out of the MLB bullpen during our playoff run...

If Williams cruises for another 4-6 starts real MLB talk seems possible. Unlikely he makes it all the way this year, but if he dominates they might be more inclined to bring him up then they usually are. Will be interesting to see how 2nd half moves line up and play out.

 

[sportscoach]

Exactly.

Both Williams and Espino may find them on the very short list soon. Either one may even make it all the way to the show this season.

If there was ever a silver lining for an injury... Maybe Espino makes up some innings out of the MLB bullpen during our playoff run...

If Williams cruises for another 4-6 starts real MLB talk seems possible. Unlikely he makes it all the way this year, but if he dominates they might be more inclined to bring him up then they usually are. Will be interesting to see how 2nd half moves line up and play out.

Neither guy will make it to the bigs this season. That being stated in 23, both could get a big league opportunity, but they will not be added to the big league roster unless the plan is to keep them in the bigs. Here's the way I see it...

We have a ton of SP depth and talent, no need to rush Espino and Williams in a WC team season and not being rule 5 eligible for awhile. Plus we have a log jam of players that may need protected. They won't be added on paper before they are considered 100% MLB ready.

Now come 23... We may end up trading a SP like Plesac for non-rule 5 eligible prospects since he is due arb money next season. We have a ton of competition and Espino and Williams will get a spring training to try for a spot, but I don't expect them to win one just yet. Come mid-23, if someone is struggling and/or we have injuries, I expect Williams and Espino are on the short list to replace those starters.

Come 24, both guys are on the 40 man and very legit chance of being on the club... Who are they replacing?

 

[petes999]

 

[CDAV45]

I'd all but given up on Benson, but he deserves credit for what he's doing this year. He turns 24 this week, he's younger than O. Gonzalez

Do you think he could be a similar hitter to Santana? Of course his excellent defense and power would come with him and that has to count for something....right?

 

[CATS44]

Cats, which part of "Will Benson now makes much more consistent contact", didn't you get?

What part of small sample size don't you get?

I've heard the exact same thing about Bradley and Chang....and Jones.

He's 24 yrs old, and has to overcome years of dismal track record with a below average hit tool.

While contact hitters can, and often do, develop power, power hitters seldom develop contact skills.

We shall see.

 

[Martyinnewyork]

I'd all but given up on Benson, but he deserves credit for what he's doing this year. He turns 24 this week, he's younger than O. Gonzalez

I know Benson has gotten our hopes up before, just last year I think you had him around #14 in your top 30 iirc, after he’d had a solid run. Then he promptly crashed and burned. But he does seem more consistent this year and I, too, am being optimistic that things are finally clicking. We’ll have to see what he’s doing after another 30-40 games before I’m convinced.

 

[MirORich]

What part of small sample size don't you get?

I've heard the exact same thing about Bradley and Chang....and Jones.

He's 24 yrs old, and has to overcome years of dismal track record with a below average hit tool.

While contact hitters can, and often do, develop power, power hitters seldom develop contact skills.

We shall see.

I'm interested in him more as a future 5th outfielder who:
-is a plus defender as a late game sub
-is a plus runner as a late game ping runner
-does at least have a power tool and some walk % decency as a pinch hitter for the 8th or 9th guy in the lineup.

Obv, going back in time, that's a mighty disappointing result for a FRP but we're not living in the past so perhaps he can still serve some value on a cheap contract for 3-5 years starting in 2023.

 

[CDAV45]

I don't understand why anyone isn't more interested in actually finding out as opposed to predicting what any of these prospects can or can't do. They all have strengths and weaknesses, and some of their history can suggest if they are likely or not to have success at the MLB, but nothing is etched in stone and talent can and has found success in countless situations when it wasn't expected.