Jesus Christ Heals You

[Hydroponic3385]

A guy named Jesus blew me once. True story.

 

[Phills14]

A guy named Jesus blew me once. True story.

Was it this guy?

 

[gourimoko]

A guy named Jesus blew me once. True story.

 

[Adam]

I have a colleague who just 'healed' someone once streets of Belfast. I worry he's not fit to teach biology now. 8 also feel sorry for the guy who walked on a recently operated on knee. Must have really really hurt the next day

 

[The Oi]

At this point, you and I are pretty much in the same boat.

Have you discussed your brand of Catholicism in a group setting at the church and gotten any kind of feedback from the parishioners? With a priest?

That's unfortunate, but... just as I wouldn't hold it against an entire race of people because of my experiences in say.. the South; I wouldn't hold it against an entire religion because of my experiences in a particular part of the country -- especially a part that is big on worshiping the Church as an institution rather than actually practicing the religion itself using the Church as a vehicle to do so.

That's fair.


Here they worship the church as an institution much moreso than using the church as a vehicle to worship God.

I think that leads to hypocrisy and, if there was a god, is the opposite of how things should be.

Why are we worshipping the flawed institution that was built to worship God? It was always just made me uncomfortable.

So let's go through these..


Now, with respect to the other two concerns; I'm going to take a contrary viewpoint here.

1) I do not believe priests should be either sexually active or married. I'm actually very much against the idea.

The arguments for an end to clerical celibacy are generally centered around a belief that it would (1) somehow end child abuse, (2) cause more people to become priests.

Addressing both of these arguments for a moment...

I would state that chastity and celibacy does not beget pedophilia. You could not remove me from sexuality and somehow convert me into a pedophile. This belief presupposes that priests exist in some cloistered world where they can't go outside, dressed as a normal individual, and pick up a hooker. It conflates pedophilia with normal sexuality and sexual desire, and assumes that celibacy somehow leads to a mental disorder where a person will predominantly target children - to which, there is no evidence that this is the case at all. By contrast, it is more likely true that people who have a predilection for such things are likely drawn to the Church (or any profession) because of the access it affords them to children in private.

So with that said, I reject the notion that having priests who are sexually active would somehow significantly mitigate child abuse. That just makes no rational sense to me if we accept the premise that the desire to specifically rape children is not something someone just decides to do like getting up and brushing your teeth; but is instead, caused by a more innate and physiological and/or mental disorder.

.

It's hard to say without being a pedophile, a priest or both. It would actually be an extremely interesting study to perform, wouldn't it? To do a mass study asking the priests who were imprisoned for child molestation whether they knew they were pedophiles beforehand or after? And did they join the cloth for the access to children?

I think it's likely a mixture of both. We can agree based on being men that these priests are going to experience constant sexual urges that are going to have to be dealt with.

So the options are...do nothing with those urges. Masturbate. Have sex with a woman. Have sex with a man. Have sex with a child.

Being a man we know that if you do resist sexual urges, they just come back. And that the more you resist, the more intense it gets.

There was a time that these guys had access to boys between both the school and their acolytes at most times of the day.

The access to the boys was almost constant. Access to women was not available. Access to other men is available at times when other priests are in town.

So while I agree that one doesn't just become a pedophile overnight, my inclination is that some of these guys molested children out of pure access to them and the lack of access to other options.

Yes, I believe that they were so overcome with sexual frustration over time that they sexually assaulted a boy in some form.

Now obviously over time a culture formed in the Catholic church where it became known as some kind of child molester's country club, so at a certain point pedophiles became drawn to the church. I think your theory here is correct. I think that's part of it.

My hope is that with such attention being drawn to the topic and the arrests stacking up, fewer pedos will join the church. I think millenials are more protective of their kids than previous generations and less trusting of the church, so I think this issue goes away organically.



Outside of the context of child abuse though; we're all hypocrites and sinners...

One doesn't confess to a priest because he thinks the priest has any right to judge him; he confesses to him so that another man can hear him say, aloud, what he did.

The purpose is to be both cathartic and therapeutic as well as psychologically and spiritually healing.

This, again in the context I used previous, should be looked at the same way as 'confessing' to your psychiatrist. It should not be looked at as confessing to say your mother, or to a further extent, God.

I see. I could see the value in that. I don't see myself doing it, but I get it.

I know this sounds weird given I've just gone on sounding like a classic Catholic apologist; but, my personal beliefs are more rooted in science than in faith.

So the question is...is this enough to get you in to heaven?

 

[ewizacft]

Imagine a child, an innocent, who is molested, raped, and brutalized repeatedly. She undergoes this form of abuse for the entirety of her childhood and adolescence until it drives her to a quite literal insanity. All this time, she was raised in a devout Christian household, and as a devout Christian, she prayed to God - constantly - to save her...

And He never did.... there was no intervention... there was no literal salvation...

So at what point does "prayer" save? At what point do we either find fault with the child for somehow not being deserving of prayer; or, by contrast, we question the power of prayer itself and decide that maybe this isn't how reality works.

Maybe, just maybe, this .. this idea that you are describing .. simply is not real...?

I realize that having these discussions is going to make me seem crazy but for your sake I am willing to have them. I should probably tell a little more about my story before I continue. I was not raised in a church going home. It was not until after college I started reading the bible. I did not attend church. After a couple years after reading the bible I finally got to the point where I believed that the bible was true. So I believed I was a christian. Years went by and I still had this inner feeling that I do not feel saved and much of the Bible still did not make sense to me. So I cried out to God one day to save me because I no longer wanted to control my life(I gave my life to him) and after that my life started to change. Something happened inside of me where I know that I am alive and saved. I feel the Holy Spirit inside of me. It was not until six months later that I started going to church. I was baptized in water for the first time about six weeks after that.

First I would like to say that the Bible is true, orderly, and complex. You have such an amazing mind that for me, I am grieved because currently you are not enjoying it the way that I see you being able to enjoy it.

To answer your scenario about the child. "I do not know" is the best answer I can give you because it is the truthful answer. This does not negate the existence of God. I would question the validity of your claim that she was raised in a Christian household if she experienced all of that. If she was then I would say that it was not functioning as a true Christian household should operate.

To answer the question about why some prayers get answered and other do not. I can not answer that because I STRUGGLE with the same question. There was a point in my life that I would could have said (doubted) that what I am describing is not real, but if I were to do that today, I would not be telling you the truth.

In order for someone to be saved they have to be born again.

This is John Chapter 3:

1 Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews.
2 This man came to Jesus by night and said to him, "Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher come from God, for no one can do these signs that you do unless God is with him."
3 Jesus answered him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."
4 Nicodemus said to him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?"
5 Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Do not marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born again.'
8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit."
9 Nicodemus said to him, "How can these things be?"
10 Jesus answered him, "Are you the teacher of Israel and yet you do not understand these things?

To come to the defense of Nicodemus, I would not have understood this either. You must be born of God's spirit to enter the Kingdom of God and it can start now. You will see the world differently when you are born of His Spirit.

 

[ewizacft]

The problem I see is when people follow blindly even when it's destructive. Or when people feel the need to convince others that their way is the only way.

Anyone who wants to reject it completely, or choose a different tool for their spiritual life, I have no argument with them. Anyone can choose to live life how he/she sees fit, no proselytizing here.

If you know of something that is going to help other people and you see someone else in need, what do you do? I feel the need to help others find the only way.

 

[ewizacft]

I support the right of all people to embrace any system of belief as long as it doesn't hurt others or bring more misery and suffering to the world.

But if the OP or the guy in the video truly believe that they have the ability to tap into the healing power of a supreme almighty God then why aren't they in a terminal cancer ward somewhere instead of out on the street dealing with relatively minor ailments?

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

I get the "go to the hospital" thing from even people who say they believe. The guy in the video(Todd White) may have done that, but I can only speak for me. Let us picture this scenario. If I were to walk into a hospital I would have to find someone in charge who would not tell me to go away. I can not just walk into the terminal cancer ward. If I were to get into a room with someone, asked to pray for them and was rejected my heart would break for them. I am not strong enough to handle it. Also like I have said before, not everyone I have prayed for has been healed. I can tell you that it is true, so why don't you go?

 

[The Oi]

I get the "go to the hospital" thing from even people who say they believe. The guy in the video(Todd White) may have done that, but I can only speak for me. Let us picture this scenario. If I were to walk into a hospital I would have to find someone in charge who would not tell me to go away. I can not just walk into the terminal cancer ward. If I were to get into a room with someone, asked to pray for them and was rejected my heart would break for them. I am not strong enough to handle it. Also like I have said before, not everyone I have prayed for has been healed. I can tell you that it is true, so why don't you go?

How do you believe prayer works?

How can we tell that something that occurs happens due to prayer and not random chance or other more explainable forces?

Do you believe that a god chooses to grant certain prayers for certain people at certain times and ignores other prayers at other times for reasons unbeknowst to us? How does he choose?

Do you believe that a terminal illness can be cured solely through prayer without any additional treatment?

Do you believe that in @gourimoko's proposed situation, prayer COULD have stopped sexual abuse from happening in a single situation. Such as, if the girl said a prayer before the attacker was attacking her, is it possible god would choose to grant it and prevent the rape from happening? How would he do it? WHY didn't he?

Will god grant prayers for non-Christians? What about really hateful people? Jews? Muslims?

Can you pray for someone else and have the prayer granted for them without them knowing?

Where do you keep going for two years at a time?

 

[jvlgato]

If you know of something that is going to help other people and you see someone else in need, what do you do? I feel the need to help others find the only way.

I don't think there is only one way. I found what works for me. I help people find what works for them.

Plus, I've learned a lot from other people's spiritual paths. In particular, there's a lot to be learned from Buddhism. One of my favorite books is Jesus and Buddha as Brothers by Thich Nhat Hanh.

I may be more Unitarian Universalist philosophically. But the practice of that religion felt lacking in spirituality for me. It felt more like a class in world religions.

 

[col63onel]

I dedicated myself to Jedi-ism, and one day will be blessed with the gift of the Force.

 

[ewizacft]

How do you believe prayer works?

Prayer works like you having a conversation with the God of the universe. So it could be just like any other conversation where you talk about your day. I say I struggle with this because every time I pray for healing I expect them to be healed. This has not been my experience but I know that God is a healer(that is his character). So even though I prayed for someone to be healed today and they were not I will continue to do so because God wants people to be healed.

How can we tell that something that occurs happens due to prayer and not random chance or other more explainable forces?

I would test it. I hope you would do the same and I encourage you to do so.

Todd White( the guy in the video) said he prayed for like a thousand people before he saw someone healed. Now he sees people healed all the time. I know that I have not prayed for even 500(that is probably more than double the true number) and know I have seen over 100 people healed. I do not know what you do with that kind of data.

In the video three people were healed. That does not appear to be random to me. What do you propose the more explainable force is? I pray in the name of Jesus and people get healed. I can not think of one. If the God of the universe says to pray for the sick, I do, and they get healed; that seems logical to me. It is all about your worldview. If you do not believe in God then you have to start trying to explain it in another way. From that prospective there has to be another explanation because God does not exist in your world.

Do you believe that a god chooses to grant certain prayers for certain people at certain times and ignores other prayers at other times for reasons unbeknowst to us? How does he choose?

That is possible. It is not for me to figure out. I pray and God does the rest.
I prayed for a certain person one week and nothing happened. I then prayed for the same person, for the same thing, the same way and he was healed. I do not get it.

Do you believe that a terminal illness can be cured solely through prayer without any additional treatment

Yes.

Do you believe that in @gourimoko's proposed situation, prayer COULD have stopped sexual abuse from happening in a single situation. Such as, if the girl said a prayer before the attacker was attacking her, is it possible god would choose to grant it and prevent the rape from happening? How would he do it? WHY didn't he?

There is a reason I do not answer these questions because I do not know. I am not God. God could intervene anyway he chooses, but I also know that he chooses to let us have free will which allows evil in this world.

Will god grant prayers for non-Christians? What about really hateful people? Jews? Muslim?

Yes. He wants to have a relationship with everyone.

Can you pray for someone else and have the prayer granted for them without them knowing?

Knowing that you prayed or knowing that it was granted? Either way the answer is yes.

Where do you keep going for two years at a time?

These last two years I started seeking God with my whole heart. God changed me. Previously I was on here like crazy even during the safaris hitting the refresh button. I feel in love with God more than everything else. I did watch the finals but it was more of a "I can not believe Cleveland is about to win a title" than caring like I once did. I am trying to become more like Christ everyday. You could ask me questions like, how do you do that? I would answer I do not know how it works. I know that it is through a relationship with him. How it works exactly. I have no clue. God does it but he will not force it upon you.

Following a list of rules is religion. For example: Read your bible.

Years ago I did read my bible but not in a relationship with God. This is a religious activity.

Now I read my bible with a relationship with God. How I went from one to the other. I think it is when I gave my life to God and he gave me the Holy Spirit.

 

[ewizacft]

I don't think there is only one way. I found what works for me. I help people find what works for them.

Plus, I've learned a lot from other people's spiritual paths. In particular, there's a lot to be learned from Buddhism. One of my favorite books is Jesus and Buddha as Brothers by Thich Nhat Hanh.

I may be more Unitarian Universalist philosophically. But the practice of that religion felt lacking in spirituality for me. It felt more like a class in world religions.

Jesus claimed to be God, rose from the dead, and said that he is the way. All who put their trust in him will also be raised from the dead and live forever. Buddha did not claim to be God and did not raise from the dead. To me it makes more sense to listen to the guy who rose from the dead.

 

[The Oi]

Prayer works like you having a conversation with the God of the universe. So it could be just like any other conversation where you talk about your day. I say I struggle with this because every time I pray for healing I expect them to be healed. This has not been my experience but I know that God is a healer(that is his character). So even though I prayed for someone to be healed today and they were not I will continue to do so because God wants people to be healed.



I would test it. I hope you would do the same and I encourage you to do so.

Todd White( the guy in the video) said he prayed for like a thousand people before he saw someone healed. Now he sees people healed all the time. I know that I have not prayed for even 500(that is probably more than double the true number) and know I have seen over 100 people healed. I do not know what you do with that kind of data.

In the video three people were healed. That does not appear to be random to me. What do you propose the more explainable force is? I pray in the name of Jesus and people get healed. I can not think of one. If the God of the universe says to pray for the sick, I do, and they get healed; that seems logical to me. It is all about your worldview. If you do not believe in God then you have to start trying to explain it in another way. From that prospective there has to be another explanation because God does not exist in your world.

That is possible. It is not for me to figure out. I pray and God does the rest.
I prayed for a certain person one week and nothing happened. I then prayed for the same person, for the same thing, the same way and he was healed. I do not get it.



Yes.



There is a reason I do not answer these questions because I do not know. I am not God. God could intervene anyway he chooses, but I also know that he chooses to let us have free will which allows evil in this world.



Yes. He wants to have a relationship with everyone.



Knowing that you prayed or knowing that it was granted? Either way the answer is yes.



These last two years I started seeking God with my whole heart. God changed me. Previously I was on here like crazy even during the safaris hitting the refresh button. I feel in love with God more than everything else. I did watch the finals but it was more of a "I can not believe Cleveland is about to win a title" than caring like I once did. I am trying to become more like Christ everyday. You could ask me questions like, how do you do that? I would answer I do not know how it works. I know that it is through a relationship with him. How it works exactly. I have no clue. God does it but he will not force it upon you.

Following a list of rules is religion. For example: Read your bible.

Years ago I did read my bible but not in a relationship with God. This is a religious activity.

Now I read my bible with a relationship with God. How I went from one to the other. I think it is when I gave my life to God and he gave me the Holy Spirit.

Everything you described is clearly working for you. Your experience with prayer has done some very meaningful things for you. I think that's tremendous and I hope you continue to follow that out.

I also hope that people are respectful of that in this thread even if they don't share your worldview.

No seizures until November 19th and I get my driver's license back. I have had to have family members cart me around ever since I had two seizures on the same day of game 2 of the ECF this year. Hadn't had one since the finals last year. Cavs streas seems to do it to me.

In PA they take your license away for six months when you have a seizure, which I think is way too long but there isn't shit I can do about it.

Anyways...you promised! So get your prayin ass on the job, you sonofabitch!!! Get me through to November. I don't believe in God or prayer, but I respect your dedication and greatly appreciate your consideration so I'll like one of your posts or something in return.

 

[jvlgato]

Jesus claimed to be God, rose from the dead, and said that he is the way. All who put their trust in him will also be raised from the dead and live forever. Buddha did not claim to be God and did not raise from the dead. To me it makes more sense to listen to the guy who rose from the dead.

That's great! I have no problem with that, and happen to agree. I also find great value in other teachings, and don't think that necessarily conflicts with my main religion, but adds to it. That's the gist of the book I mentioned.

And if others have found ways that work for them, than that's great, too. As long as it doesn't involve hurting or killing other people. And I'd be interested in how and why that way works for them. I often grow from those conversations. And find many parallels and commonalities from them. If I tell them that my way is the only way, that tends to slam the door shut, and end the conversation. Then neither one of us grows.

Related to Jigo, my wife told me about a book she read in which they took two groups of people in the hospital. They had one group for whom a group of nuns prayed for them and the other group did not. The prayed-for group had a better outcome. I can't remember the name of the book, and I never read it myself. And if I did, I suspect I'd find some fault in the scientific setup of the study or their statistics. But why bother? It's a great story, and I'd rather file it in the 'couldn't hurt, and heck, maybe it does help!' folder. I'm glad you're doing better. And I'd be happy to pray for you. It makes me feel better. And maybe, just maybe, it will help you. And for sure, it's a better world when people pull for each other in whatever way they are most comfortable.