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i think they did, plus when a burning 110 story building comes down...i think it would become pretty destructable.

here is something i never understood....

if the black box always survives the crash....why dont they make the plane out of the same material??
 
They didn't find the box.
And as for the building falling? That's another good one. Why did the buildings mysteriously crumble? The towers were made to withstand a blast like that. I know I know...jet fuel! Jet fuel would have burned up almost instantly. But for some reason fireballs shot all the way down the building and the elevator shafts burning people alive. There is no way one of those building should have fallen let alone both.

One last thing I believe it is fact that in the history of the black boxes they have found everyone except for like one. It is designed to withstand HEAT OF UP TO 2,000 DEGREES FAHRENHEIT FOR ONE HOUR, salt water for at least 30 days, immersion in a variety of liquids such as jet fuel and lubricants, AND AN IMPACT OF 3,400 G's. By comparison, astronauts are typically exposed to up to six Gs during a shuttle takeoff.

As for your question about planes being made of the same stuff here is an article http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a4_001
 
^ Very true..
 
So what is your assertion? That Bush sent demolition experts in and wired (2) 110 story buildings? Isn't this a more logical explanation?
http://www.tms.org/pubs/journals/JOM/0112/Eagar/Eagar-0112.html
Doesn't that sound a little more logical than Bush having people wire the WTC with explosives.....then arrange to have people fly 2 planes into the WTC towers....jsut so he could then blow up the 2 towers.....then make another plane disappear without air traffic control noticing.....then shoot a cruise missle into the Pentagon while claiming it was the plane Bush made disappear....then keep the cleanup crew quiet about the fact that there is no plane or bodies at the Pentagon?

How many people were involved in this wild conspiracy?
100 demolition experts who wired 2 towers.
300 sailors aboard the ship that shot the cruise missle at the Pentagon.
250 firefighters and cleanup crew at Pentagon who ignored the lack of bodies or a plane.
300 Bush, his cabinet, military leaders and other misc govt participants.
200 All the air traffice controllers around the country that ignored flight 77 disappearing and ignored an inbound missle headed towards the Pentagon.

OK, so of this approximately 1000 people involved in this extraordinary coverup...NOT ONE SINGLE PERSON HAS ADMITTED INVOLVEMENT? And how did they recruit for this conspiracy? Every single person asked to partake just said "YES! I'LL KILL FELLOW AMERICANS!" Not on person said, "**** NO!!!! I'M GOING TO THE PRESS YOU INSANE BASTARDS!"????

Get real...
 
I just want to see the other tapes that they didn't release. Its not like they show anything that we don't know if what they say happened did indeed happen.
 
First of all it doesn't take 300 sailors to launch one missle.
Bodies you say huh? I suppose you are referring to the bodies of the passengers, terrorists, and crew from the 2 planes that hit the towers right?
Well if the "heat and jet fuel" was hot enough to evaporate a black box then surely it could evaporate some flesh,bone, and blood right?

As for the pentagon and the cleanup crew there. I didn't see any engines or plane parts or bodies. That "plane" made a very small hole and "skidded" some grass off the lawn. So where did everything disapear to? I know jet fuel right? C'mon max where did everything go and why not show the whole clip rather than 3 frames that show nothing? What's so top secret about the image of plane that the public cannot be shown? If everything was so simple and easy to figure out then we wouldn't be arguing. There are just too many holes in the whole thing to just say oh ok our leaders never lie and the end.

I'll get "real" when you get logical and open your mind to think differently.
 
One thing that you have to look closely at is the way the plane supposedly came in. Looking at the hole placement in the Pentagon the plane would have had to fly 10' off the ground before hitting the building. There all kinds of statments claiming that this just isn't possible with that type of plane.
 
kevolution said:
First of all it doesn't take 300 sailors to launch one missle.
Bodies you say huh? I suppose you are referring to the bodies of the passengers, terrorists, and crew from the 2 planes that hit the towers right?
Well if the "heat and jet fuel" was hot enough to evaporate a black box then surely it could evaporate some flesh,bone, and blood right?

As for the pentagon and the cleanup crew there. I didn't see any engines or plane parts or bodies. That "plane" made a very small hole and "skidded" some grass off the lawn. So where did everything disapear to? I know jet fuel right? C'mon max where did everything go and why not show the whole clip rather than 3 frames that show nothing? What's so top secret about the image of plane that the public cannot be shown? If everything was so simple and easy to figure out then we wouldn't be arguing. There are just too many holes in the whole thing to just say oh ok our leaders never lie and the end.

I'll get "real" when you get logical and open your mind to think differently.

Get logical? Eyewitnesses saw a plane hit the building. Your the one saying that since there is no video we must assume it was something else....how is that logical?

Thre reason you only see 3 frames in that video is b/c that's all there were. It was a guard shack video....not high speed. The plane was going 500mph, tough to catch on that type of film.

True, it only takes a few people to launch a cruise missle. But at 9:00 in the morning, do you honestly think their shipmates wouldn't notice a cruise missle launch?LOL

With regards to the cleanup crew, I was referring to the Pentagon. If there were no bodies(which there were) or no plane parts(which there were), don't you think members of the cleanup crew would be screaming "IT WASN'T A DAMN PLANE!!!" Bodies were recovered and identified....did the cleanup crew plant them there after the fact?


I would encourage you to look at this analysis. Plenty of facts, plenty of pics, etc. - http://www.abovetopsecret.com/pages/911_pentagon_757_plane_evidence.html

Review the facts -
Size of 757 matches the initial size of hole in the building - somewhere between 13 and 16 feet (757 is 13 feet wide/high)
Rims found in building match those of a 757
Small turbine engine outside is an APU
Same engine has been clearly stated to not match a Global Hawk engine
Blue seats from 757 laying on ground in photos
Part of "American" fuselage logo visible in more than 1 photo
Engine parts photographed inside match a Rolls-Royce RB211
Structural components photographed in wreckage match Boeing paint primer schemes
Large deisel generator in front of building hit by a large heavy object
Large deisel engine outside is spun towards the building - could not be result of bomb blast or missile explosion
Multiple eye witnesses say they saw an airliner
Multiple eye witnesses say they saw an airliner hit the Pentagon
60+ bodies, matching the passenger list and flight crew roster identified and returned to families from Pentagon wreckage
 
Mandingo said:
One thing that you have to look closely at is the way the plane supposedly came in. Looking at the hole placement in the Pentagon the plane would have had to fly 10' off the ground before hitting the building. There all kinds of statments claiming that this just isn't possible with that type of plane.

Not sure why it couldn't. Again, it hit light poles on the way in. Some witnesses say it bounced right before impact. I just don't see how the government could get dozens and dozens of eye witnesses from every walk of life to testify it was a plane if it wasn't. Here are what a few people say. I can't post them all, but they all add up to one logical explanation - IT WAS A PLANE!

Tim Timmerman, a pilot in his home near the Pentagon:
”I was looking out the window; I live on the 16th floor, overlooking the Pentagon, in a corner apartment, so I have quite a panorama. And being next to National Airport, I hear jets all the time, but this jet engine was way too loud. It didn't appear to crash into the building; most of the energy was dissipated in hitting the ground, but I saw the nose break up, I saw the wings fly forward, and then the conflagration engulfed everything in flames…. It was a Boeing 757, American Airlines, no question….It added power on its way in, the nose hit, and the wings came forward and it went up in a fireball…A piece of twisted aircraft fuselage lay nearby...It was so close to me...” (London Guardian - September 12, 2001)

Joe Harrington, installing new furniture in Wedge 1, walked out on the parking lot before crash: ”One of my guys pointed to an American Airlines airplane 20 feet high over Washington Blvd. It seemed like it made impact just before the wedge.”

Joseph Royster, in his car:
"I was on the street driving, and then the plane went over the top of my car, just over the treetops ... It was a big aircraft just on its course."

Master Sgt. Noel Sepulveda, who received a Airman’s Medal and Purple Heart for his actions near the Pentagon:
"The plane’s right wheel struck a light pole, causing it to fly at a 45-degree angle, he said. The plane tried to recover, but hit a second light pole and continued flying at an angle. "You could hear the engines being revved up even higher," Sepulveda said. The plane dipped its nose and crashed into the southwest side of the Pentagon."The right engine hit high, the left engine hit low," Sepulveda said. "For a brief moment, you could see the body of the plane sticking out from the side of the building. Then a ball of fire came from behind it." An explosion followed, sending Sepulveda flying against a light pole." (Master Sgt. Dorothy Goepel Air Force Print News - April 15, 2002)

Cheryl Hammond, at the Pentagon's south parking lot:
"I thought they'd put out an alert or something," Hammond said. "We saw the big American Airlines plane and started running." (The Pentagram)

Mike Walter, USA Today, on the road when a jet slammed into the Pentagon:
"I was sitting in the northbound on 27 and the traffic was, you know, typical rush-hour -- it had ground to a standstill. I looked out my window and I saw this plane, this jet, an American Airlines jet, coming. And I thought, 'This doesn't add up, it's really low...And I saw it. I mean it was like a cruise missile with wings. It went right there and slammed right into the Pentagon...Huge explosion, great ball of fire, smoke started billowing out. And then it was chaos on the highway as people tried to either move around the traffic and go down, either forward or backward...We had a lady in front of me, who was backing up and screaming, 'Everybody go back, go back, they've hit the Pentagon...It was just sheer terror." (http://archives.cnn.com/2001/CAREER/trends/09/11/witnesses/)
...it turned and came around in front of the vehicle and it clipped one of these light poles ... and slammed right into the "Pentagon right there." "Now there are some people who say that it skipped and went into the Pentagon and it may have gone that way, but that’s not what I saw. What I saw was the jet went very low into the Pentagon and it went straight." "It seemed like it was a slow, graceful bank and then once it straightened out, that's when it sped up." "...you could see chunks of the wreckage on the ground, pieces of the plane.... It literally disintegrated on impact. It hit, and as it went into the side of the building it sheared off the wings." (Digipresse interview, May 22, 2002)

Michael James, who was in his car:
"The plane came over the top of us and brushed the trees. Then it looked like it hit the helicopter pad and skipped up and went right into the first and second floors." (Rocky Mountain News - Lexis-Nexis - M. E. Sprengelmeyer)

Afework Hagos, a computer programmer in the traffic jam at Columbia Pike:
”There was a huge screaming noise and I got out of the car as the plane came over. Everybody was running away in different directions. It was tilting its wings up and down like it was trying to balance. It hit some lampposts on the way in… I saw American Airline insignia and when it made impact with the Pentagon initially I saw smoke, then flames”

Phillip Thompson, stuck in traffic, gulf war veteran:
”I saw an American Airlines jet come overhead and slam into the Pentagon. The plane looked as if it were coming in for a landing - cruising at a shallow angle, wings level, very steady. But, strangely, the landing gear was up and the flaps weren't down….. and the blast hit us in a wave…..”

Levi Stephens, 23, courier Armed Forces Information Service:
”what looked like a 747" plowed into the south side of the Pentagon, possibly skipping through a heliport before it hit the building.”

Jack Singleton, president of Singleton Electric Co. Inc:
”The plane's left wing actually came in near the ground and the right wing was tilted up in the air. That right wing went directly over our trailer, so if that wing had not tilted up, it would have hit the trailer.”
 
Then how come they haven't showed any pictures with skid marks from the plane. Look no matter how many witnesses or reports you post or the govt puts out it only opens up more questions. Im not trying to be an asshole about this but things just don't add up for alot of people. For starters they could release the other tapes. They also could show somekind of photo where the plane bounced. I read a a bunch of statments from witnesses and a few said that the explosion wither kncoked them down or spun their car and these were people at least 500 yards away but yet in that video the govt put out the cones don't budge. There are a lot of things that could be answered with a simple video tape and not that stop motion shit they just put out.
 
Mandingo said:
Then how come they haven't showed any pictures with skid marks from the plane. Look no matter how many witnesses or reports you post or the govt puts out it only opens up more questions. Im not trying to be an asshole about this but things just don't add up for alot of people. For starters they could release the other tapes. They also could show somekind of photo where the plane bounced. I read a a bunch of statments from witnesses and a few said that the explosion wither kncoked them down or spun their car and these were people at least 500 yards away but yet in that video the govt put out the cones don't budge. There are a lot of things that could be answered with a simple video tape and not that stop motion shit they just put out.

I agree with u.

Maximus, I am not going to say anything but read this part of the "report":

Afework Hagos, a computer programmer in the traffic jam at Columbia Pike:
”There was a huge screaming noise and I got out of the car as the plane came over. Everybody was running away in different directions. It was tilting its wings up and down like it was trying to balance. It hit some lampposts on the way in… I saw American Airline insignia and when it made impact with the Pentagon initially I saw smoke, then flames”

Do u know what happens to not just cars, buy anything below when a plane of that size flyes over things? They get BLOWN OFF THE ROAD. Where are the reports of cars being blown off the road.

Thats all u need to read off that report to see all the bullshit flags go off.
 
RuanuLaw said:
I agree with u.

Maximus, I am not going to say anything but read this part of the "report":



Do u know what happens to not just cars, buy anything below when a plane of that size flyes over things? They get BLOWN OFF THE ROAD. Where are the reports of cars being blown off the road.

Thats all u need to read off that report to see all the bullshit flags go off.



That's all all u need to read? No blown over cars, so it BS? :chuckles:

This, "it would have blown the cars over" is down right silly.
The Jet exhaust is relative to the plane's speed past a given point.
If the plane is parked, like in the famous video of the car being blown over by the 747, then the exhaust speed relative to the car is maximized.
Further, if you sit and let the engine run up for a while, as in the video, then you create a CURRENT of air.
Now a jet moving at ~500mph past a point, the exhaust speed is MINUS the jet speed. I don't know the exhaust speed, but once you subtract 500 mph you know its not that much (because it is not supersonic for noise reasons).
Then you have the duration factor, unlike the parked 747/car video, the jet is over the highway in an instant, so no standing current could be generated.
As to Wing Vortex. These are MAXIMIZED when in take-off or landing configuration. (high thrust/high angle of attack)

SEE:

Why aren't these people of that car getting blown over???
http://www.jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=505764
http://www.jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=1075
http://www.jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=5648951

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/may2006/220506flight77.htm


Answer me this, are ALL THESE EYEWITNESSES involved too? Did the conspirators plant all THEIR people on the highways, in office buildings, in apartments to lie about a plane hitting the Pentagon? Some of these witnesses are reporters for the USA TODAY, Associated Press, etc. They're all involved too?

Here is an interview on cnn of a USA Today reporter's eyewitness account-
http://archives.cnn.com/2001/CAREER/trends/09/11/witnesses/usatoday.wav
 
Come on Max, you know damn well those pictures are of a plane coming in on approach with the flaps down and speed reduced. The Pentagon plane was coming in like a bat outta hell with an amature pilot. Ask a pilot about the maneuvers that it did.

I'm not saying that all the eyewitness reports are bogus i just want all the information. Aren't you curious to see the all the info as well or does this satisfy you?
 
Good detective work Ruanu!
 

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