adam81king
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Scot Pollard would have...
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Changing RCF's index page, please click on "Forums" to access the forums.
Welcome Taurean Prince
- Thread starter Randolphkeys
- Start date
Scot Pollard would have...
BimboColesHair
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@Cavatt had asked elsewhere what development, if any, is there left with Prince and specifically about his shooting. Here is what I found about his offensive profile in general:
Spot Up:
20-21: 35.8% frequency, 1.15 PPP, 51.6% eFG%, 64th percentile among qualified players.
19-20: 42.1% frequency, 0.91 PPP, 49.1% eFG%, 37th percentile.
18-19: 27.0% frequency, 1.17 PPP, 61.7% eFG%, 89th percentile.
17-18: 27.0% frequency, 0.98 PPP, 52.4% eFG%, 49th percentile.
Transition:
20-21: 25.3% frequency, 1.04 PPP, 53.3% eFG%, 38th percentile.
19-20: 18.6% frequency, 0.98 PPP, 55.4% eFG%, 23rd percentile.
18-19: 22.5% frequency, 1.02 PPP, 55.6% eFG%, 32nd percentile.
17-18: 18.0% frequency, 1.02 PPP, 58.8 eFG%, 35th percentile.
Pick-and-Roll Ball Handler:
20-21: 16.8% frequency, 0.69 PPP, 42.3% eFG%, 19th percentile.
19-20: 7.4% frequency, 0.66 PPP, 40.7% eFG%, 19th percentile.
18-19: 19.3% frequency, 0.82 PPP, 44.4% eFG%, 49th percentile.
17-18: 19.3% frequency, 0.63 PPP, 41.3% eFG%, 18th percentile.
Off-Screen:
20-21: not qualified
19-20: 9.5% frequency, 0.85 PPP, 46.1% eFG%, 31st percentile.
18-19: 5.5% frequency, 1.10 PPP, 64.7% eFG%, 84th percentile.
17-18: 14.3% frequency, 1.01 PPP, 51.6% eFG%, 60th percentile.
Cuts:
20-21: Not qualified.
19-20: 1.8% frequency, 1.06 PPP, 57.1% FG%, 14th percentile.
18-19: 2.5% frequency, 1.61 PPP, 81.3% FG%, 96th percentile.
17-18: 2.0% frequency, 1.40 PPP, 69.6% FG%, 81st percentile.
So right off the bat, from a "what do we want him doing on offense" standpoint. Take the ball out of his hands, full stop. If there is any area the Cavs can and should develop, it's putting him in position where ~75% of his touches are coming in spot up, off-screen, or cutting situations where he doesn't have the ball. He clearly has the skills to be a good off-ball player, but he also clearly has shown over multiple seasons that he is a huge negative with the ball in his hands. He's atrocious driving to the basket, averaging 4 drives per game, a FG% under 40%, and a turnover percentage over 10% his last 2 seasons. But he's proven he can be a good catch-and-shoot player with multiple seasons with an eFG% over 60% in that situation.
With, when healthy, Garland, Sexton, Cedi, Nance, and Dotson doing most of the ball-handling/playmaking and a clear emphasis on wanting to play through our bigs in the post and on the elbow, we should be in a position to do just that with Prince.
We need a catch-and-shoot presence as is. We are dead last in catch-and-shoot attempts per game in the league, something that I think changes when Drummond is moved (we average the 2nd most post-ups per game in the league, sure that takes away). As we move away from the post-centric offense and into more of a typical modern day NBA offense (pick and rolls, off-ball screens to get shooters open, drive and kicks) I hope we keep some of the things that came with it, specifically our wings consistency in back-door cuts this year (we are 3rd in the league in cut frequency as as a team). That kind of playstyle is right up Prince's alley in what he actually does well offensively.
I'll get to defense here a little later.
Spot Up:
20-21: 35.8% frequency, 1.15 PPP, 51.6% eFG%, 64th percentile among qualified players.
19-20: 42.1% frequency, 0.91 PPP, 49.1% eFG%, 37th percentile.
18-19: 27.0% frequency, 1.17 PPP, 61.7% eFG%, 89th percentile.
17-18: 27.0% frequency, 0.98 PPP, 52.4% eFG%, 49th percentile.
Transition:
20-21: 25.3% frequency, 1.04 PPP, 53.3% eFG%, 38th percentile.
19-20: 18.6% frequency, 0.98 PPP, 55.4% eFG%, 23rd percentile.
18-19: 22.5% frequency, 1.02 PPP, 55.6% eFG%, 32nd percentile.
17-18: 18.0% frequency, 1.02 PPP, 58.8 eFG%, 35th percentile.
Pick-and-Roll Ball Handler:
20-21: 16.8% frequency, 0.69 PPP, 42.3% eFG%, 19th percentile.
19-20: 7.4% frequency, 0.66 PPP, 40.7% eFG%, 19th percentile.
18-19: 19.3% frequency, 0.82 PPP, 44.4% eFG%, 49th percentile.
17-18: 19.3% frequency, 0.63 PPP, 41.3% eFG%, 18th percentile.
Off-Screen:
20-21: not qualified
19-20: 9.5% frequency, 0.85 PPP, 46.1% eFG%, 31st percentile.
18-19: 5.5% frequency, 1.10 PPP, 64.7% eFG%, 84th percentile.
17-18: 14.3% frequency, 1.01 PPP, 51.6% eFG%, 60th percentile.
Cuts:
20-21: Not qualified.
19-20: 1.8% frequency, 1.06 PPP, 57.1% FG%, 14th percentile.
18-19: 2.5% frequency, 1.61 PPP, 81.3% FG%, 96th percentile.
17-18: 2.0% frequency, 1.40 PPP, 69.6% FG%, 81st percentile.
So right off the bat, from a "what do we want him doing on offense" standpoint. Take the ball out of his hands, full stop. If there is any area the Cavs can and should develop, it's putting him in position where ~75% of his touches are coming in spot up, off-screen, or cutting situations where he doesn't have the ball. He clearly has the skills to be a good off-ball player, but he also clearly has shown over multiple seasons that he is a huge negative with the ball in his hands. He's atrocious driving to the basket, averaging 4 drives per game, a FG% under 40%, and a turnover percentage over 10% his last 2 seasons. But he's proven he can be a good catch-and-shoot player with multiple seasons with an eFG% over 60% in that situation.
With, when healthy, Garland, Sexton, Cedi, Nance, and Dotson doing most of the ball-handling/playmaking and a clear emphasis on wanting to play through our bigs in the post and on the elbow, we should be in a position to do just that with Prince.
We need a catch-and-shoot presence as is. We are dead last in catch-and-shoot attempts per game in the league, something that I think changes when Drummond is moved (we average the 2nd most post-ups per game in the league, sure that takes away). As we move away from the post-centric offense and into more of a typical modern day NBA offense (pick and rolls, off-ball screens to get shooters open, drive and kicks) I hope we keep some of the things that came with it, specifically our wings consistency in back-door cuts this year (we are 3rd in the league in cut frequency as as a team). That kind of playstyle is right up Prince's alley in what he actually does well offensively.
I'll get to defense here a little later.
BankShot
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Wow, you certainly nailed it.
Dr. Claw
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Offensively, looks like the Cavs agree. He was doing pretty well on catch and shoot, or other scenarios with the ball out of his hands.
BimboColesHair
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Something to add that I noticed in both his and Allen's stats when digging through all this that I wanted to wait and see in an actual game as to what exactly it looked like for the 2 of them; They are both very willing passers. Every year as a pro they have both passed the ball to other players more than they have received passes.
Last night I saw Prince make an extra swing pass to find a wide open Cedi for 3 in the corner, hit Cedi from the wing on a cut to the basket for an easy layup, and in general just kept the ball moving.
In the post LeBron era the Cavs have progressed well in moving and sharing the ball. APG as a team has gone from 20.7 to 24.2 so far this year (with most of our guards out mind you), and total passes as a team have gone from 284 per game to 304 per game. Both of those first 2 figures were near dead last in the league at the time they were put up. Moving up to 20th in APG and 4th in total passes per game in 2 years are good signs as to where this team can be in a year or 2 and, hopefully, healthy.
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The Athletic has a column on Prince and Allen which included this:
Now in Cleveland, surrounded by young players and seasoned vets, Prince wants to take advantage of his opportunity. The Cavs’ style of play reminds Prince of when he played at Baylor. He believes he can contribute defensively, guarding multiple positions, and shoot more 3s on the offensive end.
When Prince sat on the sidelines Friday, he noticed how hard Cleveland plays. Then, when he practiced, he saw how willing the players are as learners, working to improve every day. They listened. They took coaching. Prince doesn’t think he has reached his full potential, but he sees the Cavs’ environment as one that can help him reach his potential.
Coach J.B. Bickerstaff appreciates the versatility in Prince’s game, as he’s able to play shooting guard, small forward or power forward when needed.
Prince, 26, believes he can be a voice of leadership and bring knowledge and experience from his five years in the league.
“Pulling young guys to the side and guiding them through some situations that he feels like he’s unsure about, that’s what I’ll do as well,” Prince said. “Just trying to leave my mark and be a positive to this organization in any way I can.”
Now in Cleveland, surrounded by young players and seasoned vets, Prince wants to take advantage of his opportunity. The Cavs’ style of play reminds Prince of when he played at Baylor. He believes he can contribute defensively, guarding multiple positions, and shoot more 3s on the offensive end.
When Prince sat on the sidelines Friday, he noticed how hard Cleveland plays. Then, when he practiced, he saw how willing the players are as learners, working to improve every day. They listened. They took coaching. Prince doesn’t think he has reached his full potential, but he sees the Cavs’ environment as one that can help him reach his potential.
Coach J.B. Bickerstaff appreciates the versatility in Prince’s game, as he’s able to play shooting guard, small forward or power forward when needed.
Prince, 26, believes he can be a voice of leadership and bring knowledge and experience from his five years in the league.
“Pulling young guys to the side and guiding them through some situations that he feels like he’s unsure about, that’s what I’ll do as well,” Prince said. “Just trying to leave my mark and be a positive to this organization in any way I can.”
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+20 last night, led the team in that metric.
Nice debut.
Nice debut.
He and Allen add to the culture
kookoo
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Got a laugh out of some characters saying he's a bust after a couple of sloppy plays. I'm an incredibly pessimistic person, but even I felt that was a rushed assessment. I think he's going to be a cornerstone off our bench for years to come if we can draft a star 3 in the draft. But these guys are hell bent on getting a pick outside the lottery. Or maybe we can get lucky and be 14th with a chance into the lottery (not like being the top 2 worst records in the league for the last 2 seasons has actually helped). Our draft slot mojo is gone, might as well not care about position.
ansatsusha80
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He did a great job bouncing back after the slow start...
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Really nice to hear both he and Allen bring up how hard this team plays. Seems to be the one thing that jumped out to both of those guys.
Also nice to hear him say that Collin and Kyrie are "different types" of PG's, and that he was so impressed with how aggressive Collin was defensively.
Muffinalt
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If he plays like once he got more comfortable, he's a really nice add. Nice debut all things considered.
It will be interesting how the minutes shake our between our wings once Windler and Garland are back too. Someone will have to take a cut.
It will be interesting how the minutes shake our between our wings once Windler and Garland are back too. Someone will have to take a cut.