22 GM Thread!!!

[Criznit]

Wrong thread.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

I looked at him earlier as a possible replacement target for Freddie in Atlanta if they didn't get Olson...

He isnt a good fielding 1B btw, but I do like his bat...

Quick reference say Baltimore needs pitching pretty badly in their farm, not a problem for us except if using BTV Mountcastle's value is very high. He won't hit Arbitration until 24...

It's likely Arias/Freeman, plus Allen and Burns to get Mountcastle... not something I would personally do...

So a top 5 prospect (one of Arias, Freeman or Rocchio) plus two of our top pitching prospects... type of deal (outside of Espino and Williams). I am not doing it unless the price is a lot less...

It helps clear the 40 man. I would be willing to give multiple prospects for a player that I would consider a foundation piece. Keep Valera, Williams, and Espino.
I also might consider Kwan. He's off to a good start, but I don't know if he's a foundation piece.
BTW, Kwan was a college teammate of Rutschman.

 

[sportscoach]

It helps clear the 40 man. I would be willing to give multiple prospects for a player that I would consider a foundation piece. Keep Valera, Williams, and Espino.
I also might consider Kwan. He's off to a good start, but I don't know if he's a foundation piece.
BTW, Kwan was a college teammate of Rutschman.

I wouldn't move Kwan to be honest, from the fact we can trust him to produce plus the fact he has become a fan favorite. We need guy the fans can get behind ya know?

I think we all want to get upgrades, but how is the question... the FO is tight lipped, so we have no clue who they are targeting and how everyone ranks in their minds. I think we will see some changes tomorrow, like Jones being called up type of thing. I think a shuffle of the roster while we figure out who and what we can afford within the FOs reasoning.

Orioles fan said, Mancini and Santander are available, but it's very unlikely Mountcastle is dealt...

 

[Gson]

the nats are one of three or four teams that CLE and others should avoid making deals with.. for various reasons:

Baltimore: ...has leveraged health issues to negate trades... during the fact..
Tampa: ...sends overhyped & talent limited players for guys you should hold onto..
Nats: ...dealing with a front office that is beyond reasonable..

There are others.. there are also teams that just work for the CleFO in trade negotiations.. Cincinnati, Arizona, St, Louis, Seattle.. etc..

The Tigers have a very strong catching group.. including former Tribe farmhand Eric Haase.. former mets & cardinals minor leaguer Ali Sanchez, former Reds stalwart Tucker Barnhart, their well thought of drafted/developed star Jake Rogers and one of their best prospects, Dillon Dingler show the Tigers have one of the healthiest catching corps in the baseball.. None of these guys are "top tier".. but as a group.. they are strong..

 

[sportscoach]

3 top targets for Guardians ahead of 2022 MLB trade deadline

Breaking down the three top trade targets for the Cleveland Guardians ahead of the 2022 MLB trade deadline whom can help Jose Ramirez

clutchpoints.com

If you look at this, they said Setup man, 1B and OF are the targets...

 

[Gson]

3 top targets for Guardians ahead of 2022 MLB trade deadline

Breaking down the three top trade targets for the Cleveland Guardians ahead of the 2022 MLB trade deadline whom can help Jose Ramirez

clutchpoints.com

If you look at this, they said Setup man, 1B and OF are the targets...

Like most of these kinds of stories.. the "this is what you need" side of the equation is well represented.. the "this is how much you'll pay" side of the equation is left wanting... The same game is played by used car salesmen.. "... here, take a test drive...", fall in love with the car.. pay through the nose because someone else just called with an offer..

1. ..have to dealership take the offer.. and walk out..
2. ..establish parameters of what will be available/offered before proceeding..

e.g. Benintendi is owed approximately $ 4 MM for the rest of the 2022 season. He is clearly having a career type year (KC is selling high).. a + 19 prospect in the Guardians system and a lottery ticket (Competitive Balance Draft Choice, # 37 overall or another prospect) would be the top end of the offer..

no valera..
no espino
no williams..
no..hankins
no.. freeman
no...catchers

One or two of Mace, Myers, Bibee, Curry, Brennan, Tolentino or Fox..

If the Royals get a "perceived" better offer.. take it.. Deals within the division are tough.. but if a guy is being traded away.. it's only because the CleFO is of the belief the guy, while talented, wasn't going to be a core player with the Cleveland organization..

So many trades have been made by the CleFO.. and they have shown in a vast majority of deals the guys dealt.. were not what the hype said.. it's what the CleFO said when they were dealt..

Thoughts?

 

[CDAV45]

I'd like to see Drury acquired and replace Clement. It would allow a more frequent rotation of giving guys off without the downside of Clement's bat. That would also give Drury plenty of AB. He could run through 2B, 3B, LF and RF. I'm not sure if he can play 1B, but I'd guess he could.

 

[sportscoach]

@CATS44 and may as well tag @CDAV45 Lets get Happ and whatnot this way to clean up the other thread.

I wish you would remember everything that was stated Cats! We need to send you pills that are supposed to help with your memory lol

We are willing to trade prospects, that's not an issue, we just aren't willing to give them away at the same time. You know there is a difference right?

Happ doesn't fit with what the FO said they were targeting, which tells me they weren't willing to spend what Chicago wanted for him. We don't know what Chicago wanted in the off season, but it was greater than what Cleveland was willing to give...

 

[CDAV45]

What do ya know. I go to look back through some of my posts and the first one I come across is this one made on Oct 7, 2021:

"I think a corner OF upgrade is desired, but I don't think they are willing to pay the price for someone like Mullins. I feel as if someone like Ian Happ is more fitting. Not because he's a better player than Mullins(because he isn't), but instead because he is solid and could be had for a helluva lot less. Moving him out of CF would improve his defense as well."

That comment was made prior to seeing what Palacios was doing and how the organization felt about him. It was also well before Kwan had caught our attention. Everything is not as it seems when CATS has an agenda.

 

[KluberSociety]

Where would we be if we had Happ? Probably about 1 win better, and still a fringe playoff team, likely overpaying for one season where we might actually get some good value out of him.

The question was always timing, and it didn't make sense to be buyers before the season and it still doesn't make sense to be buyers at least in the context of 2 or less year rentals.

We do have a 40 man crunch so we have to condense the roster a bit but control will be key. The team is extremely young and they are only going to get better year-to-year.

There's numerous players who would make good trade bait, starting with:
Any MIF (from Rocchio to Fermin, and of course Amed Rosario if we fall out of contention)
Lefty 1B / 3B / OF (Jones, Palacios, Kwan, Brennan, Valera, etc)

 

[sportscoach]

Okay I am a bit tired of the Cubs trades that most people think will happen that have no idea what Cleveland wants so I put mine up... @CDAV45 @hockeyjohn @Gson

Two ideas are...

Baseball Trade Values: Accurate Player Trade Values: Trade Boards

Imagine you’re the GM of your favorite team. Review values of all major and minor baseball players. Use our trade simulator, figure out a deal, and debate trades with fellow baseball fanatics.

www.baseballtradevalues.com

Baseball Trade Values: Accurate Player Trade Values: Trade Boards

Imagine you’re the GM of your favorite team. Review values of all major and minor baseball players. Use our trade simulator, figure out a deal, and debate trades with fellow baseball fanatics.

www.baseballtradevalues.com

Cleveland gets
OF Happ
RHP Effross
C Contreras
(Plus maybe a lotto prospect like C Ballesteros)

Then the Cubs get, prospects matched to 40 area value, but are not allowed to include Espino, Valera, Williams, Allen, Lavastida, Naylor, Bibee, Rocchio. (I want to include Angel Martinez here too as not available).

Do you think you guys could live with a trade with those parameters?

I am guessing Arias as the main piece... so 20 more after that getting twenty more but only one of Curry/Battenfield/Burns...

 

[KluberSociety]

Happ and Contreras will almost certainly be traded, and hopefully to contend-now teams who would get immediate upgrades in their slots which will help them gear up for playoff runs. The fact that these kind of teams exist makes their market value high to the point where it makes no sense for us to try to try to match.

Try to change my mind, but I haven't seen one compelling argument for this. Maybe when we were knocking on Minnesota's door but I guess we'll have a bit of time to see where we stand come the deadline. More likely we'll be sellers though.

In what standings scenario would you make this trade @sportscoach ?

 

[sportscoach]

Happ and Contreras will almost certainly be traded, and hopefully to contend-now teams who would get immediate upgrades in their slots which will help them gear up for playoff runs. The fact that these kind of teams exist makes their market value high to the point where it makes no sense for us to try to try to match.

Try to change my mind, but I haven't seen one compelling argument for this. Maybe when we were knocking on Minnesota's door but I guess we'll have a bit of time to see where we stand come the deadline. More likely we'll be sellers though.

I sincerely believe we will buy and sell at the trade deadline.

I want Effross back in a deal with Contreras/Happ because of his production and the years he is at in his contract. He is a late bloomer but seems like he has become a legit setup man for them...

 

[Criznit]

Though it certainly will be expensive, that should not automatically disqualify us from pursuing Contreras if we are challenging for the playoffs, the division in particular.

We have a ton of prospects, pending roster juggling and a young team that could use some juice. Will be very curious to see how we navigate, especially if we are 5 games or less out of the division. If we are leading??? Things might get crazy.

 

[KluberSociety]

I sincerely believe we will buy and sell at the trade deadline.

I want Effross back in a deal with Contreras/Happ because of his production and the years he is at in his contract. He is a late bloomer but seems like he has become a legit setup man for them...

Effross is a righty averaging 91 MPH with the FB who never had a K/9 above 10 until he got called up to the majors last year. His sample size is 50 innings. He is a sinker/slider guy who has lived off called strikes (I'm guessing a lot of backdoor pitches).

I have nothing against trading for a guy like that but you've gotta temper your expectations.

If we're going to be buyers at the trade deadline we need to buy something that increases our probability of winning when it matters. Focusing on two guys, one of whom will likely be completely outside of our contention window, and one who will leave after the very beginning of it, seems silly.

In what kind of standings are you willing to match Houston's bid for Contreras?

Houston has the third highest position player WAR in the majors, despite having a catching squad that is batting .140 with -0.8 WAR. Two 35 year old catchers (Maldonado and Castro) are splitting time and actively losing games. The better of the two, Maldonado, (who is hitting .147) has a $5MM vesting option for 2023 which becomes guaranteed if he plays in 90 or more games. Guess who won't want to pay that option.

Obviously, this is a team that would benefit greatly from moving Maldonado to the bench and cutting bait with Castro, while starting Contreras. And Contreras would be great for a playoff run by filling in the lone gaping hole in their lineup.

Meanwhile what can the Guardians do with Contreras? Miss the playoffs and expend prospects while doing so? And then still lose all their big league catchers to free agency?