23 Offseason GM Thread

[sportscoach]

OGonz, Valera, Noel, Pries.

Every scouting report I can find questions his hit tool. Weve been shedding kids with no hit tool just about as fast as we can lately. If you read his various reports, you can substitute his name for Jones, Johnson, Chang, Zimmer when it comes to hitting...and Arias and Valera.

The Dodgers had him play 39 games in center last year, and 83 in the corners. Thats not how you groom a centerfielder, esp when you have an immediate opening at the MLB level.

Look at his numbers... He also had a new swing since coming out of the draft. I believe it was last season and his numbers supported a legit change.

.294/.393/.586 between AA/AAA with 31 doubles, 7 triples, 31 HRs can steal 20 bases. If the dude has an average big league contact skill he's a borderline All-Star with his power numbers. He's improved every single season with the bat... You usually don't see SO rates go down as you go up the minors...

Plus you aren't looking at the whole picture for his innings on defense. 470+ innings in RF and 330+ in CF... At AA he was playing CF mostly and at AAA he was playing RF mostly. So he isnt a plus CF but he actually isn't negative out there either. He's closer to Kwans range in CF... He's not perfect in CF, but you wouldn't be scared to have him out there either

 

[Mott the Hoople]

IF this deal is actually made, I could see Outman LF, Kwan CF, Gonzales RF.
If Outman tanks, you could go back to Kwan, Straw, OGonz.
If Straw doesn't rebound you could go Kwan, Brennan, OGonz.
If OGonz flops you could go Kwan, Straw, Valera.
Deep depth. Imagine the possibilities.

BTW, BTV shows Rosario as way more valuable than Outman. Maybe we could deal for Austin Barnes too. He could share catching duties with Zunino, and offer injury protection.

 

[sportscoach]

IF this deal is actually made, I could see Outman LF, Kwan CF, Gonzales RF.
If Outman tanks, you could go back to Kwan, Straw, OGonz.
If Straw doesn't rebound you could go Kwan, Brennan, OGonz.
If OGonz flops you could go Kwan, Straw, Valera.
Deep depth. Imagine the possibilities.

BTW, BTV shows Rosario as way more valuable than Outman. Maybe we could deal for Austin Barnes too. He could share catching duties with Zunino, and offer injury protection.

Actually Outman is likely to be the CF over Kwan...

Sincerely I would take Rosario for Outman straight up right now...

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Actually Outman is likely to be the CF over Kwan...

Sincerely I would take Rosario for Outman straight up right now...

I'd rather get Bret Hart than Outman.

 

[CDAV45]

Outman ain't good. I'm not exactly a Rosario fan, but I'd hate if we traded him for Outman.

Outman had K% in the high 20s in upper minors and high BABIPs masking his bad contact ability. Projections suggest he's pretty meh/average. And as a cOF only, that's not anything we need.

I'd shoot for Pepiot and if that's too rich, get a couple of high upside guys who don't need roster protection. Dodgers have plenty of intriguing young prospects to pick from.

Where did you get he's a cOF only because I don't believe that to be remotely accurate? He'll give you plus defense in all 3 OF positions. He can fly, gets good reads and has a huge arm. It doesn't really matter because the Dodgers aren't going to give us Outman in a one for one deal for Amed. He'd bring an offensive aspect that neither Straw or Brennan can provide without losing much defense at all. In fact, I'd say he's closer to Straw defensively in CF than Brennan. None of Straw, Brennan or Outman are sure things at this point, but the ceiling goes to Outman and it's not even close. Outman's almost .400 OBP looks to be a burden though don't it?

 

[CDAV45]

IF this deal is actually made, I could see Outman LF, Kwan CF, Gonzales RF.
If Outman tanks, you could go back to Kwan, Straw, OGonz.
If Straw doesn't rebound you could go Kwan, Brennan, OGonz.
If OGonz flops you could go Kwan, Straw, Valera.
Deep depth. Imagine the possibilities.

BTW, BTV shows Rosario as way more valuable than Outman. Maybe we could deal for Austin Barnes too. He could share catching duties with Zunino, and offer injury protection.

Outman is a far superior defensive CFer to Kwan. That way you could keep Kwan's GG in LF.

I wouldn't give a warm bucket of piss for a lot of BTV's valuations and neither should you.

In the end, I fully expect nothing further to happen to be honest. I just like the idea of it because we'd be a better team with a better chance of winning a WS. I don't buy into the "just get in and anything can happen" strategy. I think it's a lame excuse not to assemble the best possible roster.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Outman is a far superior defensive CFer to Kwan. That way you could keep Kwan's GG in LF.

I wouldn't give a warm bucket of piss for a lot of BTV's valuations and neither should you.

In the end, I fully expect nothing further to happen to be honest. I just like the idea of it because we'd be a better team with a better chance of winning a WS. I don't buy into the "just get in and anything can happen" strategy. I think it's a lame excuse not to assemble the best possible roster.

I'll be honest--I never considered the defensive potential.

I always figured Outman is decidedly NOT the guy you want batting for your team, but seeing others come at it from the bonus he provides on defense gives me a new perspective.

 

[CDAV45]

I'll be honest--I never considered the defensive potential.

I always figured Outman is decidedly NOT the guy you want batting for your team, but seeing others come at it from the bonus he provides on defense gives me a new perspective.

He revamped his swing that netted some real positive returns. He's incredibly fast and strong with big power potential. I'd guess I'd rather bank on that offensive upside while still having very good CF defense, but that's just me and it isn't going to happen. Again, we're probably stuck.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

He revamped his swing that netted some real positive returns. He's incredibly fast and strong with big power potential. I'd guess I'd rather bank on that offensive upside while still having very good CF defense, but that's just me and it isn't going to happen. Again, we're probably stuck.

Eh, since it's the third post in the series, I'll lift the facade.

I'm just having fun with his last name. I have no knowledge of the actual player. The Outman makes outs, which is bad on offense... but could be good on defense.

I figured the Bret (The Hitman) Hart reference would've tipped it off.

 

[CDAV45]

Eh, since it's the third post in the series, I'll lift the facade.

I'm just having fun with his last name. I have no knowledge of the actual player. The Outman makes outs, which is bad on offense... but could be good on defense.

I figured the Bret (The Hitman) Hart reference would've tipped it off.

Sorry, didn't read into that deeply. Didn't mean to be a killjoy.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Sorry, didn't read into that deeply. Didn't mean to be a killjoy.

 

[CATS44]

You can't pick out the 50 games worth of stats you like and ignore the rest.

Outman's K rate has not gone down noticeably. In 2021 across two levels it was 28.3%. In 2022 across three levels, one repeated, it was 27.7%.

Using a caveat like 'if he has an average contact rate, he could be (fill in the blank)' applies to just about every young player we have dumped in the last twelve months. He doesn't.


Defensively, I can't find a recent (non local, meaning non biased) report on Outman that praises him as a CF. This from fangraphs...

'Outman's feel in center is only fair, and though he can play there in a pinch, he is better suited for right, where he played all but a few times in the back half of 2022.'

But some want to trade a starting shortstop and team leader on a true contender for a prospect that isn't as good as the youngsters we already have.

Outman is older than any corner OF we presently have, except Palacios...and thats counting Naylor.

Seriously, if Outman was on our 40 man, instead of Palacios, this board would be speculating that he would be the next position player to go when we needed to make a roster move.

 

[KluberSociety]

I guess with Jones and Benson leaving and Valera maybe having injury problems we have a void of left-handed outfielders who strike out too much. Outman can fill that void.

More seriously I'd be perfectly fine with the move but it'd be trading the present for a potential future by picking up what is essentially a reclamation project. If that's what you want then fine...

PS: Anyone seen Jo Adell lately? Heard he's still available, price is down to 3 bats and an old Jugs pitching machine.

 

[CDAV45]

50 games? Go back through 2021 and look at his OBP. We haven't had anyone like that at all regardless of SO%. You're the one "ignoring the rest". Yes, his SO rate is around 28% in AA and dropped to 25% in AAA, but he also hits for a good average, takes a lot of HBP, hits for power, steals bases and plays very good CF defense. You're damn right I want to trade him for Amed who may not be the starting SS and is in the last expensive year of his arbitration. We have plenty of "team leaders". Outman comes with some risk, but he also comes with a lot of reward potential.........a lot.

"One of the best athletes in the system, Outman is a 6-foot-3, 215-pounder with plus speed and arm strength. He has aptitude for stealing bases and swiped 23 in 27 attempts last season. He has instincts to go with his quickness in center field and provides plus defense at any of the three outfield spots."

"Outman has made some real swing changes since the Dodgers took him off an unremarkable couple of years at Sacramento State, and he’s performed better and better even as they’ve moved him up aggressively due to his age. He’s one of the best athletes in their entire system who might have four pluses on the scouting report, definitely a plus run, plus arm, plus power guy who might be a plus defender in center as well."

"There’s too much swing and miss in the zone here to say he’ll be more than an average hitter, but with his other tools, that makes him a potential star, especially if he can do more against lefties than just hit for power. He’s older than any hitter on this list, but doesn’t have as much baseball experience as the typical 25-year-old. Don’t be surprised if he ends up the Dodgers’ primary center fielder this year."

This is an older one. "Between two levels last year, Outman hit .266/.379/.490 with 21 doubles, nine triples, 18 long balls and an impressive 23 stolen bases; but he struck out 139 times in 491 plate appearances. He has a decent arm and can handle all three outfield spots, just like Peters. Many believe he profiles best in center field."

I guess with Jones and Benson leaving and Valera maybe having injury problems we have a void of left-handed outfielders who strike out too much. Outman can fill that void.

More seriously I'd be perfectly fine with the move but it'd be trading the present for a potential future by picking up what is essentially a reclamation project. If that's what you want then fine...

PS: Anyone seen Jo Adell lately? Heard he's still available, price is down to 3 bats and an old Jugs pitching machine.

Jones and Benson aren't anything like Outman. Sorry, poor overall comparison.

Again, it doesn't matter because the Dodgers aren't going to give him up for Rosario because Amed isn't worth it. I like the idea though.

 

[KluberSociety]

Jones and Benson aren't anything like Outman. Sorry, poor overall comparison.

According to what exactly? In fact Benson looks very similar to Outman - an athletic guy with contact problems who has seen some recent AAA success after making adjustments. Especially if you think that Outman is a CF guy, but I'd think Benson has the edge defensively.