23 Offseason GM Thread

[CDAV45]

Reynolds is better in the corner OF than OGonz is plus Reynolds has an all around better bat that is a way more traditional and predictable style in a sense.

OGonz is the exception when it comes to production since on paper, he makes no sense to keep up his production. While you know what you have with Reynolds and Reynolds will take walks. Plus Reynolds started off really bad, which is out of his norm for him. Reynolds will likely be above 130+ while OGonz probably will never get above the 120 area he did since he does not take walks...

I don't think OGonz in the Reynolds deal is something Cleveland is against on paper, but Pirates want to really get a SP heavy return for Reynolds and we aren't going to do so...

So you don't think OGon can post and OPS+ of 120 after posting a 126 OPS+ last season in Cleveland? OK....we'll go with that.

Cleveland isn't sending a just turned 25 yr old OFer with 5 more yrs of control that posted the kind of numbers OGon did for another OFer that will be reaching FA 3 yrs sooner. Especially with guys like Kwan and Brennan already on the roster. We don't even need to discuss whatever else Pittsburgh might want. Cleveland isn't doing it and that appears quite obvious at this point. Maybe they'll change their mind, but it should be with the intention of replacing Straw with Reynolds. That's where the big improvement will come. Replacing OGon with Reynolds is marginal at best and that's only if Reynolds regains his form and OGon falters.

 

[sportscoach]

So you don't think OGon can post and OPS+ of 120 after posting a 126 OPS+ last season in Cleveland? OK....we'll go with that.

Cleveland isn't sending a just turned 25 yr old OFer with 5 more yrs of control that posted the kind of numbers OGon did for another OFer that will be reaching FA 3 yrs sooner. Especially with guys like Kwan and Brennan already on the roster. We don't even need to discuss whatever else Pittsburgh might want. Cleveland isn't doing it and that appears quite obvious at this point. Maybe they'll change their mind, but it should be with the intention of replacing Straw with Reynolds. That's where the big improvement will come. Replacing OGon with Reynolds is marginal at best and that's only if Reynolds regains his form and OGon falters.

Reynolds is a crappy CF and is way better in the corners...

Honestly, Cleveland would put in a low ball offer for Reynolds (Aka around 40 BTV in a sense) and that's it... So I don't see if happening at all and I don't see why Cleveland would go for Reynolds now unless they felt OGonz cannot keep producing and they could do the package around him plus Allen rather than having to do the heavy SP deal the Pirates want...

 

[CDAV45]

Reynolds is a crappy CF and is way better in the corners...

Honestly, Cleveland would put in a low ball offer for Reynolds (Aka around 40 BTV in a sense) and that's it... So I don't see if happening at all and I don't see why Cleveland would go for Reynolds now unless they felt OGonz cannot keep producing and they could do the package around him plus Allen rather than having to do the heavy SP deal the Pirates want...

“Crappy CF” according to who?

 

[sportscoach]

“Crappy CF” according to who?

Well stats say he is bad in CF... Look at his numbers from all of the defensive metrics. He is not a good CF and that's pretty much a fact.

If we acquired him, he would be playing RF...

 

[CDAV45]

Well stats say he is bad in CF... Look at his numbers from all of the defensive metrics. He is not a good CF and that's pretty much a fact.

If we acquired him, he would be playing RF...

You just don't listen to anyone do you. There has been a very recent conversation here about metrics and how they are and aren't useful/accurate. Bryan Reynolds isn't going to lose you any games in CF, or he'll win you many more with his bat than he will lose with his glove. I'm not even advocating that he is or should become a target, but let's keep things real here.

Defensive metrics are not reliable.

 

[sportscoach]

You just don't listen to anyone do you. There has been a very recent conversation here about metrics and how they are and aren't useful/accurate. Bryan Reynolds isn't going to lose you any games in CF, or he'll win you many more with his bat than he will lose with his glove. I'm not even advocating that he is or should become a target, but let's keep things real here.

Defensive metrics are not reliable.

He's not a good CF... that the eye test can tell as well as the stats...

 

[CDAV45]

He's not a good CF... that the eye test can tell as well as the stats...

This stupid conversation is done because it's pointless. Bryan Reynolds is not coming to Cleveland.

 

[KluberSociety]

Reynolds is better in the corner OF than OGonz is plus Reynolds has an all around better bat that is a way more traditional and predictable style in a sense.

OGonz is the exception when it comes to production since on paper, he makes no sense to keep up his production. While you know what you have with Reynolds and Reynolds will take walks. Plus Reynolds started off really bad, which is out of his norm for him. Reynolds will likely be above 130+ while OGonz probably will never get above the 120 area he did since he does not take walks...

I don't think OGonz in the Reynolds deal is something Cleveland is against on paper, but Pirates want to really get a SP heavy return for Reynolds and we aren't going to do so...

OGonz is similar to Amed only he pulls the ball more, if he can keep hitting it hard and pulling it, it'll be hard for him to completely struggle. I see him as more of a 110 wRC+ guy than whatever he was last year (not sure how that translates to OPS+, I'd guess it's similar). I've happily been wrong about him so far and he keeps hitting that ball so it's time to at least have some faith in him.

 

[macbdog]

This stupid conversation is done because it's pointless. Bryan Reynolds is not coming to Cleveland.

To the Pirates:
Oscar Gonzalez
Chase DeLauter
Charles Nagy
Darren Kirkreit

To the Gs:
Bryan Reynolds

Who says no first?

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

To the Pirates:
Oscar Gonzalez
Chase DeLauter
Charles Nagy
Darren Kirkreit

To the Gs:
Bryan Reynolds

Who says no first?

Nagy. He exercises his no trade clause to avoid going to Pittsburgh.

 

[CDAV45]

OGonz is similar to Amed only he pulls the ball more, if he can keep hitting it hard and pulling it, it'll be hard for him to completely struggle. I see him as more of a 110 wRC+ guy than whatever he was last year (not sure how that translates to OPS+, I'd guess it's similar). I've happily been wrong about him so far and he keeps hitting that ball so it's time to at least have some faith in him.

In an off year, yeah I guess I could see a 110 wRC+, but I don't think that will happen very often before he ages.

 

[KluberSociety]

In an off year, yeah I guess I could see a 110 wRC+, but I don't think that will happen very often before he ages.

If he hits the ball less hard than Amed on average with about the same launch angle I don't see the 30 HR type of season happening. Sometimes he absolutely crushes it but putting bad pitches in play just does not help power.

 

[Gson]

I'll take 9 guys in the lineup everyday who carry a 110 wRC+... with two more on the bench...

 

[CATS44]

Over the last two seasons....just under 1100 PAs....Oscar has collected 51 HRs and an additional 63 XBHs. Thats Big Mon...Rico Carty...production.

Thats 57 XBHs per season. Forget walks, forget home runs. If we get 57 XBHs from a middle spot in our lineup somewhere behind Jose, I will take that, esp with a low K rate.

I have doubts that Oscar can maintain this type of production with his approach...but he keeps doing it year after year, level upon level.

 

[CDAV45]

If he hits the ball less hard than Amed on average with about the same launch angle I don't see the 30 HR type of season happening. Sometimes he absolutely crushes it but putting bad pitches in play just does not help power.

I think a more accurate assessment would be to take the top 25% of their hard hit balls and compare those exit velocities. OGon hits the ball a lot harder than Amed when it's barreled up. Hell, he hit as many HR as Amed in what, half the AB's?