Early 22 GM Thread! (Trade Ideas here)

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CDAV45

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@CDAV45

What would you being willing to pay salary wise for Willson Contreras and trade for him?
I honestly don't know Coach. I'm not giving up any of my favorite prospects for him and I'm not putting a stranglehold on the finances to sign him. That's not to say I wouldn't love to see him in a Guardians' uniform. I guess I need some details before determining what I'd give and pay. On the BTV sight(means little to nothing) I was able to give both Naylor's and Sanquintin for Contreras and Happ. I'd do that in a NY minute, but I'm sure many would disagree.
 

PPark

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Something I wonder.

It is generally assumed that Billy Beane will be forced to step back from contending next year, because he loses so many FAs, most of his key players will get arby raises, he has little money to spend, and no upper level prospects that are close to MLB ready.

But somehow, some way, Beane seldom steps back from contending.

Oaklands payroll was around $84 mil this year. The obligation for next year is $16 mil, if he declines options on two veteran relievers, Chafin and Diekman.

To sign his total arby class is projected to cost about $56 mil, and it includes his front three SPs. If he would sign them all, he has a payroll of about $72 mil for only 13 players.

Obviously, he is gonna trade several of those arby eligibles, and probably release others. But if he does that, his 2022 team looks like it will be in the basement.

But what if he trades a few that leave him with close to a wash, while cutting his payroll?

I'm not advocating for anything, merely thinking out loud....

What if we could trade Plesac, Morgan, two MIF ( Arias, and one of Miller-Palacios-Clement-Tena) prospects and Chang for Laureano and Montas?

How would that work for Oakland?

First of all, Oakland would save about $8 mil next year.

Montas is a better pitcher than Plesac, although the difference is not gigantic...but Montas has two less years of control. Morgan is better than Blackburn...their #4 and out of options. Thats at worst a wash for any budget minded team.

So it comes down to Chang, two prospects and $8 mil in savings for Laureano. Those three MIFs not only fill a huge organizational hole, but are better options at the MLB level than what Oakland has coming back. And if Beane wants one of our fringe OFs or OF prospects, he can have that, too.

Our youngsters could replace several of their fringe arby eligible players, thereby saving Beane another $5 mil.

Beane would be left with about $59 mil after such a trade, even after retaining, every other one of his key players...leaving him with a lot of flexibility, esp if he was allowed to keep his payroll at $84 mil.

How does this work out for Cleveland?

The downsides are that it adds $8 mil to the payroll and it cuts into our immediate rotation depth.

The upside is Laureano and an improved opening day rotation. It also solves our 40 man situation.

Again, just thinking out loud.
I’d counter Jose Ramirez for Montas straight-up or the rough equivalent proposal.
 

CATS44

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I honestly don't know Coach. I'm not giving up any of my favorite prospects for him and I'm not putting a stranglehold on the finances to sign him. That's not to say I wouldn't love to see him in a Guardians' uniform. I guess I need some details before determining what I'd give and pay. On the BTV sight(means little to nothing) I was able to give both Naylor's and Sanquintin for Contreras and Happ. I'd do that in a NY minute, but I'm sure many would disagree.
Except for the financial aspects ($15.2 mil), it would be something to consider.

But contracts are traded, not players.
 

sportscoach

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I honestly don't know Coach. I'm not giving up any of my favorite prospects for him and I'm not putting a stranglehold on the finances to sign him. That's not to say I wouldn't love to see him in a Guardians' uniform. I guess I need some details before determining what I'd give and pay. On the BTV sight(means little to nothing) I was able to give both Naylor's and Sanquintin for Contreras and Happ. I'd do that in a NY minute, but I'm sure many would disagree.

I wouldn't be against it on paper for 22 to be honest. Losing Perez isn't something I want just because he is such a good catcher, but his health hasn't been good so hard to guess what way to go with him and Naylor is young but I don't know how he will be in 22 and Happ is a proven MLB player with two years of team control and he won't be 28 until the end of 22. I don't think that would actually get the deal done unless we foot all the bill, but in 22, it would improve us on paper...
 

KluberSociety

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I prefer Canha for several reasons. He is capable of playing four positions. He stays fairly healthy. He has a plus reputation as a team mate.

Pham is limited to left field and at times has been a plus defender there. But since first becoming a pro he has had difficulty staying healthy on and off the field. His persona is spotty.

Neither are truly impact players and both may be showing some wear and tear. But we are not talking about long term answers. We are looking for an improvement over what we have that acts as a bridge to what we hope to have.

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First base is not the easiest position to play. Left field is.

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Trades involving impact bats happen every year.

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We have a very good core in place. Fans may not be, but I am satisfied with it as a core. Two significant upgrades...one long term, one short...will make this an offense to reckon with.

A GM of a small market org has to base his decisions on some expectations, because he can't simply go out and buy an entire lineup like the Yankees.

My decisions have to be based on what I see over multiple years, not on one or two months of hot and cold spells.

I'm happy with both the rotation and pen, and the catching as an extension of the pitching.

I'm happy with Jose, Straw and Amed at short. I expect Amed to be average defensively and better offensively, if I just leave him alone. I expect Gimenez to be a sound 2B, maybe better. The 'competition' is over.

I'm happy with Bobby's defense at first and the way he has always worked his tail off for this org. I am not satisfied with his offense, but 1B is far from my top priority. I hope to cover my backside by bringing in a Plan B. I also am kinda wondering if Lavastida could play a little first, too. (I've seen what the Reds have done with Stephenson)

So nearly my entire focus is on acquiring two corner outfielders.

I don't want Amed out there for two reasons. I want to leave him alone for once, and let him do his thing...and I don't want to try and contend with two kiddies MIFs.

Doing so has only worked twice in history, and everyone involved is in...or should be in..
Cooperstown.

Joe Tinker and Johnny Evers. Alan Trammel and Lou Whitaker.

I'm not inflexible. If another opportunity presents itself, I'm willing to upgrade somewhere else...IB or catcher...but I'll be damned if I'm gonna watch yet another year of the sh*t show I've been watching in our outfield. I do not have a regular MLB corner outfielder on my 40 man roster.
The persona and health thing would be my two biggest worries with Pham.

When it comes to how they actually play baseball, they are very similar but I would still personally give Pham the edge. The main reason why I bring up Pham though is because I feel there's a good chance he could be gotten for cheaper or on a shorter contract.
Canha has almost 3k in innings at 1B between the pros and minors but honestly just looking at the numbers, personally I think I trust Canha out in the OF a little more (shown better range even though a lesser athlete), while Pham is the better athlete overall of the two (can steal bases and better on the basepaths), but it's so close to 1A-1B in that sense we really don't need to argue over the little details since both players on paper make sense. I just feel the innings at 1B and being the opposite hand batting wise, breaks the numbers tie since Pham hasn't played in the INF in like a decade so Canha gets the first nod.
A general re:defense (also to @CATS44 ) I guess I just don't see what Canha has done to make anyone trust him more in the OF. Pham has a better arm than Canha so in theory he could play RF. He has logged a lot of CF innings, including in 2021. Career wise, yes Canha has shown marginally better range numbers according to UZR but they were more than offset by his arm and last year they were negative anyway so not sure if we can even rely on a range advantage in the future. Not to mention, I'd imagine the guy with the better arm that can play CF, could probably do a decent job of playing RF if called upon to do so.

I do think it's a plus that Canha has 1B experience but more for depth reasons. His numbers there were not good. Pham might be able to fill in there and do the same thing, who knows. But he rated below the average 1B (-5 DRS/-2 UZR) and hasn't played there significantly since 2015 which makes me think there's probably reasons for that. But sure I'll always take flexibility.

Anyway yeah I didn't mean to put Canha down/Pham up, just honestly like analyzing these things and thinking about how best to look at them. And I think purely on the field when he's on the field Pham gets the slight edge for me, but overall Canha does cause of the health/clubhouse stuff. But yeah 1A/1B and I'd be happy if we got either.

One of the things I'd hope either would do is teach some of their approach to the younger players. Perhaps Canha is the better mentor due to personality issues.
 

CDAV45

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Is Kyle Lewis someone we should be asking about? His season was cut short by a torn meniscus, but the talent is there and Seattle has an abundance of OFers. Getting him out of CF might keep him healthy too. Seems like a good talent that might be available, but not without risk. Then again, what player comes without risk. I might prefer him to Haniger due to his inexpensiveness and control.

On the BTV sight, someone had posted a Rocchio for Lewis and Dunn proposal. If both look to be healthy I would do that without hesitation.
 

Gson

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Is Kyle Lewis someone we should be asking about? His season was cut short by a torn meniscus, but the talent is there and Seattle has an abundance of OFers. Getting him out of CF might keep him healthy too. Seems like a good talent that might be available, but not without risk. Then again, what player comes without risk. I might prefer him to Haniger due to his inexpensiveness and control.

On the BTV sight, someone had posted a Rocchio for Lewis and Dunn proposal. If both look to be healthy I would do that without hesitation.
A healthy Kyle Lewis.. imho.. would be untouchable.. He's been in the big leagues for parts of three years.. and has been injured two of them. The latest setback in his rehabilitation from his knee injury setback (a torn maniscus and surgery).. was postponed due to a setback.. He has a Nick Senzel aura about him.. If and until he shows he's fully healthy.. and stays that way.. there should be a healthy reluctance in making any deal for him.. Justin Dunn.. has some talent.. has been able to make it work at the ML level.. but was last seen making a four pitch rehab start for the Tacoma Raniers (AAA). The fourth pitch.. a less than blazing 85 mph heater.. was less than impressive. MRI results the following day were not made public..

So.. two guys with current/serious injury history.. for one of the top ten guys in the Guardians minor league system. Interest..sure.. Serious interest.. IDK.. Asking about the M's interest in having their problems become our problems.. not so much..

But if these two guys are healthy or are well on the way to being healthy.... absolutely..
 

CATS44

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Love a healthy Kyle Lewis.

I'm not sure there is any such thing. I'm 70 and wouldn't trade my knees for his.

Dunn is a pitcher with shoulder problems.

This may be a trade that neither team would make...lol.
 

CATS44

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DiPoto has a conundrum.

On paper he has excess outfield talent to trade for other needs.

On the actual field is a different story...esp for a contender.

He has four Uber prospects in Kelenic, Trammell, Lewis, and Julio Rodriguez.

Kelenic was awful and fights with management. Trammel is becoming the perpetual prospect. Lewis owns a suite in the trainers room. Rodriguez is a year away.

Rodriguez might be the best bet of them all, but Dipoto needs production now.

If the Guardians were planning to put off contending for a year or so, Rodriguez would be on my radar.
 

KluberSociety

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The price on Rodriguez will likely be excessive. MLB has him ranked #2 in all of baseball. I think there'd be a higher chance of getting a buy low on Kelenic, but I'm not sure we'd like to deal with him either. Plus he'd hopefully be able to fill in from day 1.
 

hockeyjohn

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I’d counter Jose Ramirez for Montas straight-up or the rough equivalent proposal.
This makes no sense. We have pitching and need hitting so trade Ramirez for more pitching, one that has already served a suspension?
 

PPark

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This makes no sense. We have pitching and need hitting so trade Ramirez for more pitching, one that has already served a suspension?
It was facetious. As in Beane should counter with Montas for Jose because that would be the rough equivalent to the proposed deal.
 

CATS44

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It was facetious. As in Beane should counter with Montas for Jose because that would be the rough equivalent to the proposed deal.
Its not as far off base as you would make it out to be...and far different than us trading Jose.

The key to the trade is Laureano, not Montas.

The key for Oakland is fourfold. Beane needs to cut payroll, field a 26 man roster, fill a 40 man, and rebuild his lousy farm system. And if at all possible, contend in the AL West.

This trade would be...

1) Nine years of two MLB SPs

2) Fifteen years of three MIFs, two with MLB experience

For...

1) Two years of one MLB SP

2) Three years of one MLB OF.

3) $8 mil in savings this year, probably $12-14 next year.

At least three of the players they received would start for Oakland next year.
 

sportscoach

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I am not against Laureano, but at the same time, I am not willing to give up much for him cause of the suspension...

Looking at the projected arb raises, Manaea, Bassitt, Olson and Chapman will be due 40ish million and those four could easily get a lot of prospects back... Laureano was projected at 2.8 million which really isn't even all that high and Montas was at 5.2... I think if Oakland trades, it will be from those first four names, plus Laureano would be sold low right now and honestly I don't think they will do that unless they don't expect him to be back to his old self ya know?

I think it's a good chance the A's trade at least two of the mentioned guys... personally I'd try to get Bassitt and extend him, but thats just me
 

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