Lindor trade ideas

[CDAV45]

Jones' speed isn't an issue at 3B, it's his footwork, which won't be an issue in the OF.

The Indians are full steam ahead with Jones in RF. He played the OF almost exclusively at Instructs. He'll get some playing time at 1B to add to his versatility but the strong preference is for him to be in RF.

Speed is never an issue for a 3B, however the lack of range is, and he does lack it. I hope he comes to camp, wins one of the corner OF spots, plays GG defense, and hits 30 bombs. Nothing would make me happier. When considering his lack of range, lack of speed, his size, and his hit profile he screams 1B IMO, but that's worth little to nothing.

C'mon Ed, you have to give me some creative points and admit that the lineup I put together would be fun to watch.

 

[daddywags]

Break Jones into MLB as a RF platoon partner with Luplow and play Josh Naylor everyday in LF. Leaves holes at CF, SS, 2B and 1B. Fill 'em with whoever we get for Frankie and/or the kids

 

[sportscoach]

Good grief. His best position isn't 3B and he sure as hell isn't going to play RF. I don't think he'll sniff the OF for the Indians, but maybe I'll be proven wrong. Time will tell. All I know is if he's put in the OF then the lack of range at 3B will be quantified in LF. He's slow boys and giving him more ground to cover seems absurd to me, but whatever.

As nice as it would be we're not getting Bohm.

Daniel Johnson is the fastest player on the field outside of Zimmer and has the strongest arm. I like to see him in CF, but if that doesn't occur he will be in RF.

Send Lindor and a prospect or Hedges to the Yankees for Frazier, Andujar, and Gil.

As much as I hate the idea of actually doing it, trade Carrasco to free up money and to fill SS and/or 2B immediately and add SP depth. If you want high upside prospects then get them with Cookie. That's around $30M saved by trading Lindor and him. Use a minute fraction of that money saved to sign Renfroe and bring back Hernandez. Renfroe could probably be signed for $5M for 2 yrs and Hernandez would likely come back for a 2 yr $12M deal.

Put Renfroe in RF, Frazier in LF, and let Mercado and Johnson battle for CF duties with the 2nd place finisher being the 4th OF. Zimmer and Luplow will just have to stay in the minors or go away. The lack of potent OF bats would come to an abrupt halt, and cheaply.

The IF would have Ramirez at 3B and Hernadez at 2B. Andujar at 1B. Chang, Miller, and a return from the Carrasco trade can fight for SS duties.

The lineup would look something like:
1. Hernandez
2. Ramirez
3. Andujar
4. Reyes
5. Frazier
6. Renfroe
7. Johnson
8. Chang or whoever
9. Perez

Chics and fans dig the long ball and they'll be exiting the yard frequently. All for around $50M. The highly rated prospects can force their way into the lineup and fill in for injuries. I'll leave it to you guys to figure out the bench players, but Mercado, Naylor, a UIF, and a backup C will be needed.

Cherny, feel free to copy and paste or print this off. Just make it happen.

Johnson isn't playing CF, he isnt good at CF. You can be the best athlete in the world but it doesn't make you a good CF. I ran a 4.4 in the 40 and I stunk defensively in the OF. I never was a good route runner in the OF. You couldn't find anyone better defensively at 1B than I was. (Between a back injury and a physical condition I had to quit).

My point is, it's not about pure speed, its how you react, move and whatnot to the ball. Johnson's numbers say he could be a plus RF and an average CF at best. I wouldn't be afraid of him being out there, I just think you are wasting his skillset and his talent by putting him at a position he was okay at, not the one he would be great at.

 

[Gson]

Johnson isn't playing CF, he isnt good at CF. You can be the best athlete in the world but it doesn't make you a good CF. I ran a 4.4 in the 40 and I stunk defensively in the OF. I never was a good route runner in the OF. You couldn't find anyone better defensively at 1B than I was. (Between a back injury and a physical condition I had to quit).

My point is, it's not about pure speed, its how you react, move and whatnot to the ball. Johnson's numbers say he could be a plus RF and an average CF at best. I wouldn't be afraid of him being out there, I just think you are wasting his skillset and his talent by putting him at a position he was okay at, not the one he would be great at.

WOW... JUST WOW !!.. Are you the only person in the world who was timed at 4.4 "blazing" seconds in the forty FOOT dash?..

 

[sportscoach]

WOW... JUST WOW !!.. Are you the only person in the world who was timed at 4.4 second in the forty FOOT dash?..

I think you got it all wrong, it was 40 meters in high school going a 4.4, but I think I can do 40 inches in 4.4 seconds now haha

 

[CDAV45]

Break Jones into MLB as a RF platoon partner with Luplow and play Josh Naylor everyday in LF. Leaves holes at CF, SS, 2B and 1B. Fill 'em with whoever we get for Frankie and/or the kids

Doesn’t inspire me but whatever. At this point in time I just want some answers.

Johnson isn't playing CF, he isnt good at CF. You can be the best athlete in the world but it doesn't make you a good CF. I ran a 4.4 in the 40 and I stunk defensively in the OF. I never was a good route runner in the OF. You couldn't find anyone better defensively at 1B than I was. (Between a back injury and a physical condition I had to quit).

My point is, it's not about pure speed, its how you react, move and whatnot to the ball. Johnson's numbers say he could be a plus RF and an average CF at best. I wouldn't be afraid of him being out there, I just think you are wasting his skillset and his talent by putting him at a position he was okay at, not the one he would be great at.

If Johnson isn’t playing CF then Jones isn’t playing LF or RF because he sucks at it. Johnson has played a helluva lot more CF for the Indians than Jones has in a corner OF. Johnson is good in CF because I’ve seen him in CF and Tito said he can play CF. He’s as good or better than Mercado and damn well better than DeShields. He’s been in a corner OF mostly, not because he’s not good in CF, but because there isn’t any other corner OF prospects. Johnson doesn’t have to win a GG in CF if you don’t put 2 guys on the corner that are terrible defensively. Jones pretty much fits that description and if it weren’t for his heralded bat would not be a professional baseball player. The only position that he might be average or slightly better at is 1B. You don’t agree, but watch what happens.

 

[daddywags]

Doesn’t inspire me but whatever. At this point in time I just want some answers.

Doesn't inspire me, either. But it is what it is.

 

[sportscoach]

Doesn’t inspire me but whatever. At this point in time I just want some answers.


If Johnson isn’t playing CF then Jones isn’t playing LF or RF because he sucks at it. Johnson has played a helluva lot more CF for the Indians than Jones has in a corner OF. Johnson is good in CF because I’ve seen him in CF and Tito said he can play CF. He’s as good or better than Mercado and damn well better than DeShields. He’s been in a corner OF mostly, not because he’s not good in CF, but because there isn’t any other corner OF prospects. Johnson doesn’t have to win a GG in CF if you don’t put 2 guys on the corner that are terrible defensively. Jones pretty much fits that description and if it weren’t for his heralded bat would not be a professional baseball player. The only position that he might be average or slightly better at is 1B. You don’t agree, but watch what happens.

DeShields has never played CF that bad before, something was off with him. He has been a gold glover out there until last season (look it up) and Mercado is a way better CF, but he stinks in the Corners. Our defense would be better with Johnson in RF and Mercado in CF. Stats support it by a long shot so you have to play the best defense if you have them both out there. Plus Mercado is just as quick as Johnson btw..

 

[avs2000]

DeShields has never played CF that bad before, something was off with him. He has been a gold glover out there until last season (look it up) and Mercado is a way better CF, but he stinks in the Corners. Our defense would be better with Johnson in RF and Mercado in CF. Stats support it by a long shot so you have to play the best defense if you have them both out there. Plus Mercado is just as quick as Johnson btw..

Mercado will bounce back. Imo

 

[CDAV45]

DeShields has never played CF that bad before, something was off with him. He has been a gold glover out there until last season (look it up) and Mercado is a way better CF, but he stinks in the Corners. Our defense would be better with Johnson in RF and Mercado in CF. Stats support it by a long shot so you have to play the best defense if you have them both out there. Plus Mercado is just as quick as Johnson btw..

Johnson has never played CF as bad as DeShields did either, and he's a better athlete. Routes and reads improve with experience as long as the athletic and mental abilities are there. Johnson has both in spades.

" Defensively, he's graded as at least above average with a solid ability to read fly balls from all three outfield positions, although the majority of his upside lies in his plus arm strength. He's also been rated with plus speed as he could likely rack up at least 30 steals in the majors with regular playing time. Scouts also like his professional, mature attitude as well as how coachable he is. Of course, this is the least surprising aspect of his profile as the Indians specialize in bringing in players with strong personalities in addition to their skills on the field."

If Mercado hits, then I agree that he will be the CF or at least should be because his bat doesn't profile in the corners. Conversely, Johnson's ability to play CF isn't limited by his tools(power and arm) that fit the RF profile. Like I said, if Frazier and someone like Renfroe were brought aboard then I would allow Mercado and Johnson to compete for the fulltime CF duties with the loser being the 4th OFer. How does the team not benefit from that? Simply stating "Johnson can't play CF" is inaccurate and wrong. Also, Mercado's sprint speed is under 30 ft/sec(29 is his best) while Johnson eclipses 30 ft/sec. So no, Mercado isn't "as quick" as Johnson btw. Like I said, only Zimmer is faster than Johnson.

 

[sportscoach]

Johnson has never played CF as bad as DeShields did either, and he's a better athlete. Routes and reads improve with experience as long as the athletic and mental abilities are there. Johnson has both in spades.

" Defensively, he's graded as at least above average with a solid ability to read fly balls from all three outfield positions, although the majority of his upside lies in his plus arm strength. He's also been rated with plus speed as he could likely rack up at least 30 steals in the majors with regular playing time. Scouts also like his professional, mature attitude as well as how coachable he is. Of course, this is the least surprising aspect of his profile as the Indians specialize in bringing in players with strong personalities in addition to their skills on the field."

If Mercado hits, then I agree that he will be the CF or at least should be because his bat doesn't profile in the corners. Conversely, Johnson's ability to play CF isn't limited by his tools(power and arm) that fit the RF profile. Like I said, if Frazier and someone like Renfroe were brought aboard then I would allow Mercado and Johnson to compete for the fulltime CF duties with the loser being the 4th OFer. How does the team not benefit from that? Simply stating "Johnson can't play CF" is inaccurate and wrong. Also, Mercado's sprint speed is under 30 ft/sec(29 is his best) while Johnson eclipses 30 ft/sec. So no, Mercado isn't "as quick" as Johnson btw. Like I said, only Zimmer is faster than Johnson.

You know that Mercado was one of the top to first base in the league right in 19? Right handed hitters have a big disadvantage in that stat and he was one of the best. Plus Mercado has gotten over 40 steals in a season in the minors. Johnson has never gotten to 30 in the same time frame in the minors. (Mercado got to 50 in a season, while Johnson got to 29, once again another factor that isn't just a speed one but a mentality one)

Mercado has a way higher Range in CF than Johnson does, in three times the innings. Mercado is actually almost useless outside of CF defensively going by his 19 and earlier numbers. Also as bad as DeShields looked in CF this season, his numbers in CF are superior to Johnsons as well.

My point is this, why put a guy who has had a below average range factor and whatnot in CF when he is well above average, if not going toward gold glove, in RF plus has a cannon for an arm in CF. One of the reasons why we didn't keep Urshela was the fact he wasn't that great at other positions. He could play there and you wouldn't be scared of him there, but why play a guy who isn't great at that position everyday when there is a position he could win a gold glove at? Keep Johnson at the position he is legitimately good at not put him where he can play but not great at. Look at the numbers, Johnson has a 50ish rating out of 80 in CF while around a 70osh in RF. Mercado is around a 70 in CF but 50ish at the moment in the corners. That makes no sense for me to do

 

[DCTribefan]

You know that Mercado was one of the top to first base in the league right in 19? Right handed hitters have a big disadvantage in that stat and he was one of the best. Plus Mercado has gotten over 40 steals in a season in the minors. Johnson has never gotten to 30 in the same time frame in the minors. (Mercado got to 50 in a season, while Johnson got to 29, once again another factor that isn't just a speed one but a mentality one)

Mercado has a way higher Range in CF than Johnson does, in three times the innings. Mercado is actually almost useless outside of CF defensively going by his 19 and earlier numbers. Also as bad as DeShields looked in CF this season, his numbers in CF are superior to Johnsons as well.

My point is this, why put a guy who has had a below average range factor and whatnot in CF when he is well above average, if not going toward gold glove, in RF plus has a cannon for an arm in CF. One of the reasons why we didn't keep Urshela was the fact he wasn't that great at other positions. He could play there and you wouldn't be scared of him there, but why play a guy who isn't great at that position everyday when there is a position he could win a gold glove at? Keep Johnson at the position he is legitimately good at not put him where he can play but not great at. Look at the numbers, Johnson has a 50ish rating out of 80 in CF while around a 70osh in RF. Mercado is around a 70 in CF but 50ish at the moment in the corners. That makes no sense for me to do

Problem is you cannot steal first base.

 

[sportscoach]

Problem is you cannot steal first base.

Oh there is a way, but it requires to swing at a ball that gets away from the catcher at strike three lol

 

[DerekG123]

Johnson doesn't have to be the full time CF but he can atleast be the backup. Our OF situation is desperate enough where we need to consider every option possible to get young talent out there. Don't pickup some 30 year old career scrub to back up Mercado. Let Johnson get those swings.

 

[CDAV45]

You know that Mercado was one of the top to first base in the league right in 19? Right handed hitters have a big disadvantage in that stat and he was one of the best. Plus Mercado has gotten over 40 steals in a season in the minors. Johnson has never gotten to 30 in the same time frame in the minors. (Mercado got to 50 in a season, while Johnson got to 29, once again another factor that isn't just a speed one but a mentality one)

Mercado has a way higher Range in CF than Johnson does, in three times the innings. Mercado is actually almost useless outside of CF defensively going by his 19 and earlier numbers. Also as bad as DeShields looked in CF this season, his numbers in CF are superior to Johnsons as well.

My point is this, why put a guy who has had a below average range factor and whatnot in CF when he is well above average, if not going toward gold glove, in RF plus has a cannon for an arm in CF. One of the reasons why we didn't keep Urshela was the fact he wasn't that great at other positions. He could play there and you wouldn't be scared of him there, but why play a guy who isn't great at that position everyday when there is a position he could win a gold glove at? Keep Johnson at the position he is legitimately good at not put him where he can play but not great at. Look at the numbers, Johnson has a 50ish rating out of 80 in CF while around a 70osh in RF. Mercado is around a 70 in CF but 50ish at the moment in the corners. That makes no sense for me to do

Every stat you posted is circumstantial. What I gave you is actual times. It's simple and it doesn't matter how you try to slant it, Johnson is faster than Mercado, his arm is a lot stronger than Mercado's(who has a good arm), and his offensive ceiling is much higher than Mercado's in every measurable statistic. Again, you don't have enough data from Johnson's CF experience to determine anything there. Defensive metrics are notorious for being all over the place anyhow. That's the reason Chisenhall could be a GG caliber one season and a below average player the very next.

Which one would you rather have as your CFer? One that was slightly better by defensive metrics(with little information to even base that on), but lacked the offensive ceiling or vice versa? Would you rather a 254/321/357/678 hitter or a 284/344/460/804 hitter in CF if both were adequate defensively? Maybe what kind of hitter they have been doesn't matter, and/or maybe the defensive metrics don't tell the whole story. Either way, if a big bat or 2 is brought in to man the corner spots, there is nothing wrong with allowing Mercado and Johnson to battle it out. May the man who best helps this team be left standing. There is no reasonable argument against that and I find it odd that you would even try.