Thoughts on trading Jose Ramirez

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BimboColesHair

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One thing to add that hasn't really been brought up, and its a primary reason the Indians didn't go head on (or in the least it didn't progress far enough to leak to the media) with extension talks with any of their guys this offseason once Lindor was moved.

There is a ton of uncertainty around the league and the CBA that is up this winter. Lot of bad blood between the MLB and MLBPA right now.

2 Covid impacted seasons, no 2020 minor league season, last year under the current CBA. Tough operating circumstances for teams that aren't either fully in on spending and winning or selling and tanking.
 

WhoAzcue

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Yes, and I spelled it wrong. Gazinta is the proper spelling. I apoligize for the airror.
I pretty sure that Jethro Bodine--the creator of the gazinta--had no idea how to spell it either.
 

jup

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Hopefully something gets done to lock Jose up for awhile. I'd like to see Eddie extended as well, but don't know if that's possible. You know he's the type of person that would love to be in Cleveland for a bit and the type of person they like. After that, all they'll need is a 1B with a big bat and they'll be in the playoffs another 5 straight years or more.
Bad idea. Either let him play the contract out or trade him, but don't extend him.
 

Gson

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Bad idea. Either let him play the contract out or trade him, but don't extend him.
Extending a player, any player, after finishing their age 32 season is generally a bad idea.. A version of this, Salvador Perez, was extended 4 years from his age 29 season through age 33, just one year more than Jose will be when the suggested extension would "kick in".. The realities of the cold hard world are clear.. getting old, wins.. The most an extension should be would be through Jose Ramirez's age 34 season..or a lot of $$ for the back end of what may be & usually is a declining part of most player's career..
 

WhoAzcue

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Bad idea. Either let him play the contract out or trade him, but don't extend him.
I might agree with you if you gave a reason why. Because otherwise you've made an insinuation to knowledge that the rest of us aren't privy to. Unless you just think he's going to turn into a pumpkin at 31.
 
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WhoAzcue

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Extending a player, any player, after finishing their age 32 season is generally a bad idea..
Age 31. And keep in mind, I'm not keen on paying guys dearly for past performance. But if you can get a deal that is fair to both sides, I'd have no problem extending Jose through his age 33 or 34 season. It's a fair bet he'll still be productive. But if the Tribe passes, I have no problem with that too.
 

Gson

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Age 31. And keep in mind, I'm not keen on paying guys dearly for past performance. But if you can get a deal that is fair to both sides, I'd have no problem extending Jose through his age 33 or 34 season. It's a fair bet he'll still be productive. But if the Tribe passes, I have no problem with that too.
what are you doing up at 4 am?
 

WhoAzcue

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what are you doing up at 4 am?
Ha-ha...watched a replay of the Cavs smoking OKC on the OKC feed because Bally Ohio didn't show it at midnight for some reason. That meant it started at 1 AM (midnight OKC time). Fell asleep on the couch as soon as the game ended (they edited out halftime) and then woke up disoriented and checked out the forum while brushing my teeth. I'm asleep now.
 

LL3

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Ha-ha...watched a replay of the Cavs smoking OKC on the OKC feed because Bally Ohio didn't show it at midnight for some reason. That meant it started at 1 AM (midnight OKC time). Fell asleep on the couch as soon as the game ended (they edited out halftime) and then woke up disoriented and checked out the forum while brushing my teeth. I'm asleep now.
I too sometimes type in my sleep (some say it is my best work :cool: ) -- well done, sir!
 

jup

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I might agree with you if you gave a reason why. Because otherwise you've made an insinuation to knowledge that the rest of us aren't privy to. Unless you just think he's going to turn into a pumpkin at 31.
Just my two cents:disdain (30):.

Didn't know I had to have a reason to comment, or how a harmless comment seems to be an alleged "insinuation". But since you posted it .....

Why would you extend someone, when you already have "the best" years at the "lowest price". Take a great deal and make it worse ???? Sounds like great resource management to me.

Unless you think Jose is just going to get better the older he gets. Then sign him up until he is 100. Otherwise, why add on lesser productive years, adding greater risk to the contract, at a higher price point ???

Just doesn't seem to make any economic sense to me. Thus the short version - bad idea, play out the contract or trade him - that is my two cents on the matter.
 
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CDAV45

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I might agree with you if you gave a reason why. Because otherwise you've made an insinuation to knowledge that the rest of us aren't privy to. Unless you just think he's going to turn into a pumpkin at 31.
Some get agitated by jup, but I like him even if I don’t agree with him. I find his directness usually accurate with a hint of controversy. Which in my tiny little mind is funny.
 

CalBuckeyeRob

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Just my two cents:disdain (30):.

Didn't know I had to have a reason to comment, or how a harmless comment seems to be an alleged "insinuation". But since you posted it .....

Why would you extend someone, when you already have "the best" years at the "lowest price". Take a great deal and make it worse ???? Sounds like great resource management to me.

Unless you think Jose is just going to get better the older he gets. Then sign him up until he is 100. Otherwise, why add on lesser productive years, adding greater risk to the contract, at a higher price point ???

Just doesn't seem to make any economic sense to me. Thus the short version - bad idea, play out the contract or trade him - that is my two cents on the matter.

You would only extend him if the total financial package when combining the 3 years left with the additional time gives the right balance of savings for the Indians and risk reduction for Ramirez. He is making $35 million over the next 3 years. A 4 year extension now at something like $105 million might make sense for both sides. He then gets $140 million over 7 years and Cleveland locks him in at a $20 million average out to age 35. I think they will just trade him during or after this season, but there is a path to keep him if Ramirez has any worry about that next contract when it is 3 years out.
 
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xmasbuck

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Extending a player, any player, after finishing their age 32 season is generally a bad idea.. A version of this, Salvador Perez, was extended 4 years from his age 29 season through age 33, just one year more than Jose will be when the suggested extension would "kick in".. The realities of the cold hard world are clear.. getting old, wins.. The most an extension should be would be through Jose Ramirez's age 34 season..or a lot of $$ for the back end of what may be & usually is a declining part of most player's career..
to be sure, Perez turns 31 in a month or so - the 4 year extension starts next season
 
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Steve_424

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Ultimately for me it's hard to formulate an opinion on this for two reasons:

1) I have no idea how much Jose would ask for and how long of a deal he'd want.
2) I have no idea how soon, internally, the Indians see themselves as serious contenders again
3) I have no idea how close, if at all, they are to replacing Sherman and/or selling the team.

But right now, I have no interest in dealing him this year or next unless someone absolutely blows them away with an offer. You have an MVP-caliber player locked up through age 28-30 and a team-friendly deal, a top-notch pitching staff, a ton of talented young bats that are close to the bigs, and no significant money tied up in anyone?

This potential lineup has a lot of promise, and you'd have some cash (currently budgeted to E. Rosario/Hernandez) to upgrade 2-3 spots based on how the players below develop this year. You also have some minor league depth to trade from.

C-Roberto Perez
1B-Bobby Bradley
2B-Tyler Freeman
SS-Andres Gimenez
3B-Jose Ramirez
LF-Nolan Jones
CF-Amed Rosario (or trade Rosario for a CF)
RF-Daniel Johnson
DH-Franmil Reyes
 

LL3

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Just my two cents:disdain (30):.

Didn't know I had to have a reason to comment, or how a harmless comment seems to be an alleged "insinuation". But since you posted it .....

Why would you extend someone, when you already have "the best" years at the "lowest price". Take a great deal and make it worse ???? Sounds like great resource management to me.

Unless you think Jose is just going to get better the older he gets. Then sign him up until he is 100. Otherwise, why add on lesser productive years, adding greater risk to the contract, at a higher price point ???

Just doesn't seem to make any economic sense to me. Thus the short version - bad idea, play out the contract or trade him - that is my two cents on the matter.
Perhaps obvious, but also not addressed -- how many $, and how long is the hypothetical extension.....hard to really know if it is a good or bad idea without some working numbers.
 

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